Topic for Forum Regulars about all 3 items. Legacy, The Fall and the games.

[RzaRecta357]

So, I figured i'd start a topic like this about EVERYTHING for us to go over as I see someone is trying to get all the facts straight with the games in another topic and I believe that many of us on this forum are very smart and have played the other games enough to know whats going on.

So obviously this thread will be FULL of SPOILERS if you continue reading it.

This is PlagueDoctor357 BTW and hoping to have my regular account allowing me to sign back on again soon.

Anyway, here are some random thoughts on all subjects.

First, The Fall. Who has read it? I think the first issue was AWESOME. It was short, but gives you a good feel for it. Hell, they could just repaint the crossbow into a rifle and make me a game all about Daniel and Nikoli (Or However it's spelled I forget now.)

I think that this comic also shows us the ancestors matching face thing. If you look at Daniel, he basically looks exactly like his ancestor but with piercings and a more modern look of course.

So im assuming it's a running thing with the series to have the Main character and his ancestor look alike.

Also, which staff is it that the templar is holding? Does anyone know? It looks quite a bit different than the papal staff and don't remember reading anything about it during AC2 or Project Legacy. (Although im only on Rome pack chapter 3 of that).

Alright, now this one here is bound to start a little discussion or problem.

The Subject 16 and Desmond being related thing.

I just don't understand why everyone thinks that they are. I know it shows them both and says searching for data but so what?

There are tons of animuses or animi or whatever you want to call it.

So the one in Warren's office has only had two subjects in it.

16 and 17.

Now think of the subjects brain as a hard drive.

When they are plugged into the animus and it boots up, it searches for the hard drive.

Find hard drive 17 and brings it up.

It doesn't mean they were related. If Viddic was obssessed with Italy in the end he would of eventually found the Vault if 16 was going through Ezios memories also, wouldn't he?

So i'd like to hear your thoughts on that everyone.

Ok, thoughts on ACB.

I thought it was weird that Lucy's computer password is Juno with some numbers added on.

Pretty cool you actually go into her temple as Ezio for one of the secret lairs also.

The red trail leading to the hide out is gone at the end of the game if you go outside and eagle vision before going to the triangle (I tried this on my second playthough for the heck of it.)

So I guess there are three explanations to the lucy stabbing.

Either she was a sleeper agent ala Terminator salvation cyborg hero.

Maybe she truly was a Templar but her emails To William M (Sounds like Desmonds father?) don't sound like it. Also the little girl chats with Rebecca and what not.

Im choosing to believe that Juno knew he loved Lucy and had to kill her so he could do the Eve thing.

OR. She says they can't avoid his grasp or something along those lines. Now I think were supposed to believe she's talking about time and how it erodes them. But perhaps she's talking about something else entirely. Some other evil entity.

So Shaun basically mentions French Revolution right? I read on the forums that the Church that supposedly is built above the Temple of Jupiter is in france also.

So? What's everyones take on that? Is it a dead given that were going to have Desmond jumping back in the Animus to find temple of jupiter and perhaps the shroud or something in france?

I read Daniel Cross's book was supposed to cross over to the game some how? Is this true?

All I know is after beating AC1 and 2 4-5 times each I can safely say that it is NOT Subject 16's voice when they stick Desmond back in the animus during the credits.

It's two new voices and Desmond saying No.

Definately. Massive Surround Sound to prove it and im sure there are youtube videos now too.

Im even thinking that the whole throw him back in thing is just a device to get us back in to finish playing around after end game and it'll start off with Desmond not even in an animus next game or something right off the bat.

All I know is im super excited and there's so much back story with this comic and Legacy that it's amazing.

I wish they would make a pure Daniel cross game as it's cool just to see some one different go in an animus and his ancestor is cool with a rifle and a dagger/hidden blade.

[BK-110]

I won't bother reading the whole thing, but I'll comment on the relationship between Desmond and 16. The Animus was searching for a memory match between the two and found one in Ezio, meaning that Desmond and 16 have a common ancestor. Sure, they might not be closely related, but to some degree they are.

[TheSpectator]

It is definitely not the papal staff as it was permanently sealed under il vaticano having fulfilled it's purpose.

Also further evidence that they are related is shown when sixteen is reliving adams memories in the truth vid and desmond is also a descendant of adam therefore related.

[Redfeather1975]

Originally posted by RzaRecta357:
The red trail leading to the hide out is gone at the end of the game if you go outside and eagle vision before going to the triangle (I tried this on my second playthough for the heck of it.)

Also, any relics, Desmond may have found around the villa, are missing from the shelf during the part near the end where you are to look at the triangle in Eagle Vision.

As to whether it is intended or not. Have no idea. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

[RzaRecta357]

Aha! I also notcied the artifacts being gone haha.

Im just not seeing why people believe it's finding data between the two of them. It brings up the only two subjects that have ever sat in that animus. Scans the subjects brain realizes it's 17 and then 16 fades off and 17 comes up.

The exact words for the search are Searching for Relevant Data. As in, searching for one of these subjects Ancestors. It finds Ezio and then 17 pops up because it found its relevant data, which is Ezio.

Also, the truth video is seen from a 3rd view. As in NOT Adam OR Eve.

I still don't think they're related. But in a way, always with Desmond as he said.

[Jellyfloater]

The Staff that appears in AC: The Fall is the Staff of Eden, i.e. the Papal staff. It was first used by the Pharoahs, then Alexander the Great had it, then Moses, and from there, it passed through the papacy starting with Peter. At some point it passed from the Papacy to the Russian Tsars. The staff sinking into the ground was basically plot so that Ezio wouldn't have some ridiculously overpowered weapon. It presumably either resurfaced, or was rediscovered, probably by one of Rodrigo Borgia's successors.

http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/The_Staff

[RzaRecta357]

Hmm Im about to go read the wiki but I know there is more than one apple.

This staff looks quite different than Rodrigos. Perhaps there was two?

[samward]

So I know this is a very very old thread... but as I am in the UK, I JUST got the comics and finished reading them. I have looked threw here, and this seems to be the one thread that there is any real convo about the comics... if there is a more up to date or relevant one, if some one could redirect me, that would be great.

I had a look on Assassin's Creed Wiki and it was somewhat enlightening, but did not mention any of the things I was hoping to get answers or speculation on. So I came on here to see if there were some old threads I could read through. But I could not find much at all. I am rather surprised I was not able to find more discussion on here. At any rate, I just had some thoughts floating around in my head and wanted some general feedback.

COMIC SPOILERS



So we know that Daniel Cross was a sleeper agent. Crazy, but very cool, we also know that he is subject 4.We know at the end he goes back to Abstergo and is placed in the animus to keep him stable. We also know that it was Vidic who planted something into Cross to make him the sleeper agent...and to relive his ancestors memories without the animus... or maybe that was just the bleeding effect... not sure...

The whole thing got me thinking. What if Lucy was a sleeper also? I mean that might explain why she seems genuinely concerned and invested in Desmond and yet why some of her other actions/ convo surrounding her, not to mention the end of ACB, seem to incriminate her as a Templar. Also in the Comic they mention William Miles, so who ever this guy is, he would have known about the first sleeper agent and would have known that was a weapon in the Templars arsenal he had to watchful for.

Now I know it was Juno that made Desmond stab Lucy but could it be possible that she was responding to the Templar Sleeper technology placed in Lucy? And could it be possible that through their emails that William had figured out she was a Sleeper also and was trying to keep her from doing anything dumb and pulling a Danila Cross?

Also when the Comic ends Daniel Cross is back at the Abstergo lab, permanently plugged into the Animus. Now we know that the Abstergo lab Cross goes to is in Philly and since Vidic was also there, it is a possibility that Cross remains there alive, hooked up to an animus in the present day of the game storyline . Now while it is possible that Vidic moved labs, it is just as likely that he did not and that Desmond was held at the lab in Philly, which means that he may have been in the same room that Cross may have once been. I am not sure how this all links, or even if it does at all... but it seems strange that 16, and Desmond were in the same place and quite possibly Cross, and 16 left messages inside the Animus for Desmond to find, Desmond is currently trapped in the Animus and Cross is using it like life support...

Do you think that Cross will also make an appearance to Desmond within the animus? Or that maybe 16 was able to contact Cross while he was still alive as he has Desmond, now`? I know that there is no evidence for this... just curious.

Anyway... Very interesting... will be very disappointed if they don't really embrace the comics in the games, as they directly effect the storyline.

[blazefp]

I'm too lazy to read this all :P

[RzaRecta357]

I'm hoping he does somehow. They said it would cross into the game but hopefully more than just the Mentor stuff being lost.

[Poodle_of_Doom]

Originally posted by BK-110:
I won't bother reading the whole thing, but I'll comment on the relationship between Desmond and 16. The Animus was searching for a memory match between the two and found one in Ezio, meaning that Desmond and 16 have a common ancestor. Sure, they might not be closely related, but to some degree they are.

If I remember correctly, Lucy explained this as well, and similarly to how you have....

[CRUDFACE]

Originally posted by RzaRecta357:
Aha! I also notcied the artifacts being gone haha.

Im just not seeing why people believe it's finding data between the two of them. It brings up the only two subjects that have ever sat in that animus. Scans the subjects brain realizes it's 17 and then 16 fades off and 17 comes up.

The exact words for the search are Searching for Relevant Data. As in, searching for one of these subjects Ancestors. It finds Ezio and then 17 pops up because it found its relevant data, which is Ezio.

Also, the truth video is seen from a 3rd view. As in NOT Adam OR Eve.

I still don't think they're related. But in a way, always with Desmond as he said.

Okay, time to do this.

Subject Sixteen

First of all, I need to go over the subject of sixteen. Now, why would Sixteen's name pop up now? If they were the only two to ever be in the animus, then why wouldn't it have whon up later. And if you read the abstergo emails in that special website that requires the code, you'll see that Subject 15 might have been there as well as Lucy served with her alongside Vidic.

Also, the search highlights a specific genetic sequence, Desmond's moves to that exact same sequence then it gets highlighted, they both grow in light then we're treated to Ezio's birth. It shows that they have the same DNA and therefore are related.

If not, we can go back and forth as to why he is or not on a seperate thread, where one person puts idea up while the other counters.


The Fall

Concerning the comic I think they took some liberties with how the assassins do things. Take Nikolai's equipment, his hidden blade is just that, only a blade, nothing more. No gun, poison, hook, the writers weren't exactly up to speed. Like the statue of Ezio for some reason didn't have him in the full master assassin's robes, only the Mesaglias (sorry if I misspelled, lol).

and if they made a game about it, the comic would loose it's focus, like the story was tight, precise and good in the end. If it becomes a game, they'll have to stretch it in certain places, and in doing so, ruin how strong it was. I'm okay about a game maybe being after it, but not the same thing as the comics.

When they said "Cross in the game" I thought it already did with the death of the Mentor. But there was another roomer in there that Daniel might be in future AC games. After all, with his memory, they might've also found out where the splinter of the staff that Nikolai took is. It's not know if he dropped it off with he Russian assassins or took it to America.

Lol, it does show the overshadowing of an ancestor. I mean, the best way to see yourself doing something is to see yourself IN something, a part of it. It's a cool use of psychology


Lucy


Lucy...oh Lucy. You can tell they really wanted to put in our heads that she was the villain. Rebecca said Lucy had her own ways of sneaking Animus hardware out, then Lucy herself says some old passwords work when she's trying to spy on their system. then there's the sob story of how she was attacked at night. It could be fake, I know, but at the same time she could be a sleeper agent. They did make Cross into one after all and you saw what he did.

Desmond's sees her as an ally, but lets a big leap of faith to go on (pun intended) but I think she might've been turned while she was under employment, and Desmond seems petty easy to fool.


TWCB and ending

First of all, the developers themselves explained on a couple of sites where basically she pushed him over the edge finally and he ended up in a coma because of the added stress of the bleeding effect and hurting and possibly killing Lucy. Now, in the end, well, after the end, during the DLC that the other man is named William. but the other guy is not as good with the animus as he is as he calls himself an expert and he follows instructions.

Sixteen met Desmond in the animus, or what was left of him. And by some miraculous chance that he is alive because, I don't know, they used the shroud on him since in Project legacy a memory showed a Templar finding the shroud. He was in the care of Abstergo and I doubt they'd let the body/him/or the remains get away without them knowing.

I've posted before as to why Jupiter might be featured...why not do it again...crap:
-Fathered the most demi-gods, TWCB hybrids
-He's eagle themed, relating to eagle sense and beak shaped hoods
-told Hephaestus what to normally make, have something to do with POE creation
-God of the sky and that's where our 2012 incoming threat is coming from.
-Leader of the gods
-knew mortals the most, or got with the most, lmao
-One of his epithets or titles (Jupiter Eclicius) had to do with calling forth celestial omens

God, I'm gonna love once the Encyclopedia comes out and tells me everything I need to know.

[blazefp]

Originally posted by t260z:
God, I'm gonna love once the Encyclopedia comes out and tells me everything I need to know.


Amen to that (tough I'm not much of a believer :P)

[CRUDFACE]

Originally posted by blazefp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by t260z:
God, I'm gonna love once the Encyclopedia comes out and tells me everything I need to know.


Amen to that (tough I'm not much of a believer :P) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Lol, I'm not either, but I'll join in that Amen! Agnostic whoop woop!