U.S. has entered the wimpenpoodle phase of empires

[leitmotiv]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/...&pos=7&asset=&ccode= (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Health-Care-Law-Signals-US-cnbc-4091862289.html;_ylt=AmekzUcC.N0rE1hKcHqp2WG7YWsA; _ylu=X3oDMTE1cTZjdjgzBHBvcwM5BHNlYwN0b3BTdG9yaWVzB HNsawNkb2VzaGVhbHRoY2E-?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=7&asset=&ccode=)

[falling-bird]

Current financial climate might signal decline of Asset Management hedge fund managers, rather than Empire of USA

British Empire was on the decline after WWI, and Independence movements of India and emancipations of Canada and Australia were not brought about by the formation of the NHS

China’s health care system is socialist, indeed communist, and it has not seemed to affect its growth. It may well have contributed to it.

[Ba5tard5word]

After getting bailed out by the taxpayers, I think Wall Street should shut the hell up about governmental policy for a while. You know what is really bad for the economy? Letting Wall Street do whatever the hell it wants. See October 2008.

[LW_lcarp]

Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
After getting bailed out by the taxpayers, I think Wall Street should shut the hell up about governmental policy for a while. You know what is really bad for the economy? Letting Wall Street do whatever the hell it wants. See October 2008.

I think we should let em do whatever they want to do. BUT when they screw up and lose it all don't come crying to the taxpayers to bail their rears out of the fire.

[GoToAway]

A lot more than the healthcare issue has signaled this.

The rise of China and India as well as the fact that the EU's GDP has exceeded the US' for the better part of a decade are all strong signs that it's in decline.

This is just a drop in the bucket.

I will watch the coming decades with great interest. The US certainly isn't ready to become second (or more likely third) fiddle any time soon. I suspect that the Obama administration is the calm before the storm. Here's to hoping he stretches that to 2016, because I don't see the LCD of American society going quietly into the night.

[thefruitbat]

leitmotiv, i have to call you on this one, i know you know much more about history than this,



The passage of the health care law shows that the US empire is declining because it illustrates the fact that people expect the state to take care of them, David Murrin, the co-founder of Emergent Asset Management hedge fund manager, told CNBC.

In their expansionary phase, empires force people to go out, seek risks and fend for themselves, Murrin said, reminding of the dismantling of the British empire after the war, when the National Health Service, which ensures universal health coverage in Britain, was created.

So the british empire only starting declining after WWII, and the NHS, thats news to me, and also a complete load of ********. WW1 broke the empire, as you well know, and it was on the decline even before, as you also well know.

Well cling to want you want...

[GoToAway]

leit is a nationalist. History has no bearing on such feelings.

Don't believe me? Look at Nazi Germany, the USSR, or the "cult of personality" in North Korea today.

When people give into nationalism, perspective goes out the window. And that seems to have happened to leit, which saddens me because he seems like a bright guy. We need people that understand the past to fight for the future.

[VW-IceFire]

Seems to me that the US really started to go downhill when it entered into that pointless war in 2003. That seems to be what "empires" do... they keep embroiling themselves in more and more pointless conflicts to try and hold onto their power until it truly begins to fade away.

National healthcare on the other hand pretty much everyone in the developed world has... welcome to the 20th century. The rest of us were here a while back. Thanks for coming out.

[AndyJWest]

Originally posted by GoToAway:
leit is a nationalist. History has no bearing on such feelings.
...

I'd say Lietmotiv is a proponent of a particular ideology, rather than an ardent nationalist, though the end result is much the same. He seems to be taking comfort from the failure of his ideas to have the effect he expected by adopting the persona of an eighteenth-century poet. Sometimes entertaining, but of little relevance to the modern world. If he lived in the UK, the National Trust (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Trust_for_Places_of_Historic_Interest_or_ Natural_Beauty) would probably lobby the government to be allowed to preserve him for future generations, in the same way they preserve stately homes.... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

[erco415]

Originally posted by GoToAway:
leit is a nationalist. History has no bearing on such feelings.

Don't believe me? Look at Nazi Germany, the USSR, or the "cult of personality" in North Korea today.

When people give into nationalism, perspective goes out the window. And that seems to have happened to leit, which saddens me because he seems like a bright guy. We need people that understand the past to fight for the future.

Or, for that matter, the cult of personality in the US.

[leitmotiv]

GTA speaking in code here: I am tarred a "nationalist", which is his code for being a vegetarian Nazi nationalist, socialist, like Hitler. Another typical subtle analysis from the Kindergarten. I like my country---I know this is a radical concept to some. I also like England---does this make me a National Front type? I also like Germany. What pejorative can you come up for this? I like Holland and would hate to see it become an Islamic Republic by proxy. What can you do with this? I have a fondness for Sweden, the land from which my mother's father came. Does this make me Gustavus Adolphus?

WWI certainly did smash the British government with crippling debt. One could ask how much the cost of the war plus the cost the social insurance programs passed just before the war left the employers without any money for retooling to modern factories after the war. WWII was the coup de gras, and this is clearly what the gentleman in the story meant, without being too pedantic, after all his specialty is finance, not academic history.

What he is aiming at is national resolve, determination, and innovation. He sees a pattern in the will to build socialism. He sees this as a confession of defeat.

I would say it is the death of imagination, of which you can see much of in the West, unless you consider interesting forms of decadence imaginative, such as the enormous drug and sex industries in the U.S., which have doubtlessly sapped and diverted the minds of many.

[AndyJWest]

the enormous drug and sex industries in the U.S., which have doubtlessly sapped and diverted the minds of many

Ah yes, the perils of an unregulated market. You forgot to add the bit about it making people blind Liet. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

[LEBillfish]

Originally posted by LW_lcarp:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
After getting bailed out by the taxpayers, I think Wall Street should shut the hell up about governmental policy for a while. You know what is really bad for the economy? Letting Wall Street do whatever the hell it wants. See October 2008.

I think we should let em do whatever they want to do. BUT when they screw up and lose it all don't come crying to the taxpayers to bail their rears out of the fire. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

.....and I think not in that they don't screw up with their money, just other folks.....ask all those who had earned secure retirements, worked hard all their life to be able to sit back and enjoy the golden years what it is like to say.....

"Welcome to Wal-Mart".....

K2

[NAFP_supah]

Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
After getting bailed out by the taxpayers, I think Wall Street should shut the hell up about governmental policy for a while. You know what is really bad for the economy? Letting Wall Street do whatever the hell it wants. See October 2008.

Google "Community Reinvestment Act", politics borked Wall Street. The banks in the end just tried to make a profit out of a situation they were forced in by government intervention in a working market. In the end the CRA did noone any favours including the very people it was designed to help.

[Worf101]

Empires rise, empires fall, get over it. And when the inevitable happens try to shuffle off of center stage with a bit of grace and as little bloodshed as possible.

Worf