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BM357_TinMan
12-24-2003, 07:49 PM
It's kind of large, but it's kind of cool.

If you have high speed internet, it's worth the wait.

http://www.bm357.com/movies.htm

bm357_dow. Right click save target if you can

Thx

BM357_TinMan

BM357_TinMan
12-24-2003, 07:49 PM
It's kind of large, but it's kind of cool.

If you have high speed internet, it's worth the wait.

http://www.bm357.com/movies.htm

bm357_dow. Right click save target if you can

Thx

BM357_TinMan

Blade_X__
12-25-2003, 12:18 PM
Honestly, the cheesy camera effects are lame. They need to go. =/
Just my opinion though.

WUAF_Badsight
12-25-2003, 08:54 PM
yea i second that

i DL these movies to see some cool flight footage or see a part of WW2 played out .... not because im hoping they have nice effects : ((

BM357_Raven
12-25-2003, 09:46 PM
Hmmmm.. I didnt know tin was gonna post these here, and quite honestly, I dont pretend to think they compare with the works of Scragbat, ShadowSix, and half a dozen other great artists whose works continue to inspire us all.. Those boyz rock...

But for a first timer I dont feel too bad about these first attempts either. I'll help you two out a little, I was trying on the first track to make a loud, 357th promotional 'music video' that glamorized the P-51 kinda like a commercial.. Cheezy? I guess that is especially what I would think of the first.. But Forgotten Battles with Crystal Method in the background is hardly supposed to be taken seriously..

On the second, I took a five minute battle between me and Tin and his brother who was in the 109. He and I took off heavy, met some AAA, then spotted OYS coming in from the south, so we dropped our payload, but Tin didnt drop in time and ole OYS dropped him. Then I came around on him to avenge tin.. I said to myself, 'hmmm, there's a story in all that..' So I set some sad music to the whole thing, made it kinda MTV-ish, abstract, and messed with the chronological order of things a little and hoped to spark a sense of irony in the whole thing..Sounds like it flopped..lol. Oh well..

But trust me boyz, I'm just rolling up my sleeves and trying to self-teach myself After Effects (which is NOT an intuitive program).. Be sure I will turn out a few more like these before I make any great works, if ever-- so your 'constructive criticism' or whatever you were hoping 'to see' is something I gotta reject as thoughtless and discourteous. I would be happy to give you both lessons, for example:

"For those who are looking for an authentic historical perspective, these 'videos' are a little over the top. Perhaps you might include some flight footage such as_________., But keep working at it Raven. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif" [actually, if it were me, I would use even milder words than these, but oh well..]

I can point out pleanty that is technically wrong with them, so trust me I dont even really want a critique. I like em and Tin likes them, so that works for me. What do I like about them? I like how they evoke emotions (one is kick *** Americana, the other a kind of tragedy), but that's just me. I have a lot to learn.

But again, these are music videos and a fun learning experience for me... I plan to make a few more of these music videos, before of roll up my sleeves and get serious. But thanks anyhow boyz, and Merry Christmas... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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UCLANUPE
12-26-2003, 12:23 AM
Wow I was surprised a bit at the first couple of responses, but I still d/l it.

First welcome to the IL-2 FB movie making forum/community. I understand your feeling about the critical comments. It is not easy to make movies for FB, especially if you use special effects(which has become the norm for our community movies). Like you I would have hoped for a more helpful initial couple of reviews. However, when you are releasing a product to the 'public' you basically will get this from someone at some level no matter who you are or how good your product is.

It hurts when your artistic vision is not well received. That is mainly because film making, like any other artisic endeavor, evolves from the creative genesis of that visionary artist and that is VERY personal.

I would hope that you would continue to make movies and use this as fuel to fire the obvious creative vision that you have inside.
--------------

Now to the movie. I liked it! I see it as a good first effort. I would suggest a refinement of the use of the special effects so that they don't overwhelm the scene. This is a RAZOR thin edge or how much is too much and IS better left to the visionary IMHO. As you make more movies you will find a comfortable place.

I LOVED the song Dust in the Wind was one of my favorites from the 70's, nice pick for the story.

I say thumbs up and I look forward to more from you soon. S!

Ben_Pond
12-26-2003, 05:39 AM
Don't sweat the hecklers from the peanut gallery, TinMan and Raven! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Making an IL-2 movie is a daunting task, to be sure. I commend you for taking the time to make an IL-2 film. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

With that said, I have to agree with them on some level. Personally, I prefer fades from one scene to the next. If you're shooting for a "commercial" type look, then you might try using some standard wipes, but noting beyond that.

Of course, that is only my personal opinion. It's you're movie. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

By the way, After Effects has a sweet tool called motion sketching, used to simulate a shaky camera. It's not terribly difficult, and the result look absolutely sweet.

If you're interested, I have a tutorial on my website that explains exactly how to use this effect. You can find it at Wartime Productions (http://www.hollowlife.net).

Also, there is a wealth of information at the Virtual War Cinema (http://www.blacksheepwebdesign.net/VirtualWarCinema/). Most of the movie-makers are registered there, and any of us would be happy to help you any way we can. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

JRJacobs
12-26-2003, 07:17 AM
1- Welcome to the addictive world of Virtual Cinema come on over and visit the pros, semi-pros and tyro‚'s at www.virtualwarcinema.com (http://www.virtualwarcinema.com) http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif
2- I've posted 20 or 30 times about the difference between criticism and critiques. To say a move is ‚"lame‚"Ě, or ‚"cheesy‚"Ě is pure criticism and should be ignored. To offer advice like ‚"I would suggest a refinement ‚....‚"Ě Or ‚"this is something I‚'ve seen in movie XYZ and it‚'d look great in your move‚"Ě is critique and should be welcomed. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif
3- Finally, in my opinion [and it‚'s only my opinion, I could be wrong] a ‚"FIRST‚"Ě movie is for the person making it Ė to see what you can do so to speak. subsequent movies are for the community so I‚'ll save my critiques for your ‚"Second‚"Ě movie http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

"if you're a story teller and someone listens while you tell that story you're an artist...
If you're a story teller and no-one is listening while you tell that story you're schizophrenic...
I like to consider myself a story teller... if it weren't for you i'd be crazy"

"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it."
-- Robert E. Lee

Virtual Movie Forum at http://www.blacksheepwebdesign.net/VirtualWarCinema/

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BM357_Raven
12-26-2003, 11:14 AM
Thanks guys, I appreciate your thoughts and words of encouragement. If Tin had asked me if he should post these here, i would have said not to, because I dont feel they 'fit' the overall 'motion picture' movement (or quality) here, nor do I really think they are critic-worthy[i] :S, but uhh, Tin...lol..

And, I am not put down by anyone's comments so far here, but I dont mind replying in my own dull-toothed way, either, if I am moved to do so... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I was noticing the motion [i]sketching as I understand it is called.. I wasn't sure if artists were moving the frames themselves, but now I am glad to know there is a tool to do it for you. very cool, and I will soak up the tutorials you offer, so thanks. Are people employing the same tool when the shake the ground for explosions, or is that usually done manually?

For now, I think I will stay on the outskirts, and make my own little brand of flick as I try to hone (hone, is that spelled right?) in on my whatever might become my genre.. I have two concepts that I would like to work on....one that I think might be enjoyable by the whole community if I can do it right. Sigh...

My brand of media, almost always, imo is a little loud, busy, and, well, over-the-top. So I think I would need to tone my stuff down to find better acceptance here on the whole. But, uh, we'll see what I can come up with...

Perhaps I'll just remain off the curve in this respectm, never to generating quite what is in sync with the pulse of the audience. But when I think I really got something, I'll post it here, and shoulder the criticism... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I am glad you three came along and voiced your oppinions...

Fellas, S~

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fani16
12-26-2003, 04:32 PM
I liked ithttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
really cool effects

ShadowSix
12-26-2003, 06:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BM357_Raven:
If Tin had asked me if he should post these here, i would have said not to, because I dont feel they 'fit' the overall 'motion picture' movement (or quality) here, nor do I really think they are _critic-worthy[i] :S, but uhh, Tin...lol..

Are people employing the same tool when the shake the ground for explosions, or is that usually done manually?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hello Raven and Tin--We welcome all FB movies, clips, questions, and advice here on this board. From comical skits to music videos to historical epics, all virtual films are well-received here. To achieve the ground-shake effects in films, some filmmakers use camera-shake video filters or simple mouse wobble techniques.

--ShadowSix

Ben_Pond
12-26-2003, 09:13 PM
Raven, two techniques I've used for vamera shaking are the "Motion Sketch" tool in After Effects, and the "Shaky Cam" tool in Animation Shop 3.

Also, all the notions you have about what we want in a movie - forget that! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Really, there is only so much we can do in IL-2. Shoot planes down. Blow up ships. Bomb ground targets. Shoot more planes down. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

So if you want to go off on a wild tangent, then that would be welcome, lest we all begin making cookie-cutter movies, ya know? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Anyhow, best of luck to you, and I hope to see more from ya.

BM357_Raven
12-28-2003, 04:55 PM
Lol..you guys are great.. Thanks!

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Blade_X__
12-28-2003, 05:42 PM
My post wasn't meant to flame, just an opinion...hopefully you took it as such. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

WUAF_Badsight
12-30-2003, 07:36 AM
hey i got nothing to apoligise for

they were posted at a public forum

if you dont want to hear things you might not like dont let them out to the public

this is a FB movie thread & they were way different to what has been released here B4

there was no intro as to them being that different

my opinion is that as a FB movie it sucked

but as a test bed for movie making is was a good production

WUAF_Badsight
12-30-2003, 07:46 AM
i mean do you want honesty or do you just want a pat on the back ?

JRJacobs
12-31-2003, 09:45 PM
Woof you seem like a decent chap, so I‚'ll add my critique of your posts.
There is a difference between ‚"Honesty‚"Ě and ‚"Tactless‚"Ě To say a persons work is ‚"lame‚"Ě [not your post but you specifically agreed] or infer the hard work of someone is not cool enough for you to have bothered to download, or to state your ‚"opinion is that as a FB movie it sucked‚"Ě. is √¬*√¬•√¬™√¬≥Ž√ľ√¬≤√¬≥√?√¬*Ż√© nyekulturny or uncultured.
At worst you got what you paid for. No one posts on a PUBLIC forum hoping someone makes their efforts feel unworthy of the forum. They DO hope for some praise for the parts they did well and critiques of what they can do to improve their work. Notice the moviemakers included in their posts ‚"ideas‚"Ě to improve the work‚.... Even when they AGREED with your opinion of the movie.
‚"if you dont want to hear things you might not like dont let them out to the public‚"Ě, excuse me‚.... This is a Movie MAKERS forum not a Movie CRITICS forum‚.... How about‚.... If you have nothing nice to say, don‚'t say it?
No one ‚"asked‚"Ě you to apologize‚... then again no one asked you to trash someone‚'s work either.
I do not think you are married, for I know the first time your wife asked you ‚"do these make me look fat‚"Ě you would become manifestly aware in the difference between being ‚"honest‚"Ě and being ‚"tactful‚"Ě.
If this makes you upset enough to flame me‚.... So be it‚... it was NOT my intent, and I apologize in advance‚.... But I will never claim, ‚"I was just being honest‚"Ě

"if you're a story teller and someone listens while you tell that story you're an artist...
If you're a story teller and no-one is listening while you tell that story you're schizophrenic...
"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it."
-- Robert E. Lee
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WUAF_Badsight
12-31-2003, 10:48 PM
considering what they were .... some description of the contents would have been nice

there are still many people on the internet with 56k connections

VMF513_Viper
01-01-2004, 12:45 AM
Gentleman and Ladies,

Lest us not forget the rules of this forum. Many meant well in critiquing this movie and some did it with a tasteless and tactless manner. However, there are certain guidelines for the newcomers of this forum and still applies to the regulars here as well.

I am not going to let this forum turn into the GD and ORR forums, and I will do what is neccessary to keep it as such.

This is for Raven: Raven well done on a first try, I cant remember the day when i had my first test bed like yours. It only gets better my friend. The more you learn and read trust me my friend you will learn and be with the best such as Ben Pond, Scragbat, JrJacobs, Davinci, Ripper, and Ucanlpe (Sorry If I mispelled the name). Remember the old addage "A Good Pilot is always in training". Same thing applies here.

A suggestion for everyone else and I will exclude those that this does not need to be said to. This is a forum for the enjoyment of Movie Making. I will not and shall not let this forum turn into a flame war. If this post continues to be a flame I will lock it. Also, some of you need to realize that people are in a learning state, they do tend to learn from the first bad or poor movie they make. Saying it is lame is not a tactful way of expressing your opinion here. If I say that you are lame for posting that here the tides will turn on you, but I shall not. I suggest some need to learn Message board ettiquette when posting their thoughts.

My point should be very clear on this. This is a fun environment, let us keep it as such.

(Note to the regulars: Giving our newer folks a heads up so dont think that this is solely directed toward anyone in particular)

So Sayeth the Viper Evermore!

S! Viper

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JRJacobs
01-01-2004, 07:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WUAF_Badsight:
considering what they were .... some description of the contents would have been nice

there are still many people on the internet with 56k connections<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sir, i agree with you 100%... it would have been nice, and very helpful and i will try to make sure in any of my future movies i "alert" all the readers to the "flavor" as well as the content of my movie.... appologies to you... and happy new year.


Thanks Viper

"if you're a story teller and someone listens while you tell that story you're an artist...
If you're a story teller and no-one is listening while you tell that story you're schizophrenic...
"It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it."
-- Robert E. Lee
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BM357_Raven
01-01-2004, 06:47 PM
Thank you JRJacobs and VMF513_Viper. And Happy New Year to all. My head is no longer throbbing from last night (lol--uggh) and at the moment I am downloading a movie that I haven't seen before--my collection is getting larger as my hard drive is shrinking. Time to start burning CD's I suppose.

It's amazing how many creative people have poured their energy into this endeavor and it is equally terrific how many people are downloading and watching them.

S~ All!

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