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Natchai_Ubisoft
02-18-2016, 11:04 AM
Greetings agents,

While we’re thankful for all the effort you put into taking back the more secure parts of New York, we’d like to ask you to make a difference in the Dark Zone.

We’re aware that it’s a scary place to find yourself, but maybe, the longer you spend there the more comfortable you’ll feel constantly living in the face of danger?

Anyway, we’re looking to find out just how long you’re willing to spend in the Dark Zone this time around.

//- End Transmission_

iota-09
02-18-2016, 02:01 PM
as much as the DZ stuttering bug will allow me to.

please for the love of god i hope you guys fixed that.

GotShadow
02-18-2016, 02:08 PM
as much as the DZ stuttering bug will allow me to.

please for the love of god i hope you guys fixed that.

Hey iota-09,

Be sure to report any bugs you find over on the bug forums:

http://forums.ubi.com/forumdisplay.php/1153-Xbox-One

The team is monitoring it very closely during the open beta :)

Bjorn_38
02-18-2016, 11:48 PM
What i am affraid of is that the game will resolve to much arround the darkzone,in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.

Willhelm_55
02-19-2016, 12:18 AM
Personally I figure I'll be in and out. I like that its not a seperate client and can just be entered in game. If things start getting grindy or stale, I'll mix things up with the DZ. After all is said and done the DZ will probably be the pleace to go for shananigins.

iota-09
02-19-2016, 12:28 AM
What i am affraid of is that the game will resolve to much arround the darkzone,in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.

you actually can,in the closed beta i was full blue equip, and my main guns were a lvl 8 scar-l outfidtted with damage modifiers and a stock LVL5 M1A, and can you guess which one was the most effective against full gear rogues at the designated distance of the weapon?

yeah, i'm sure i don't have to tell you, what i have to tell you though, is that i could even get int o close range against said full gear rogues and still come out of it alive if i played right, all with the scar-l (which i'll post in a second how was)

many peopole make the error of thinking that the yellow guns are dthe definitive guns: they're wrong, while they are way better than grey and green guns, and have an edge onto blue guns, when you get to specific classes like dmrs or to purple guns, you'll see that they aren't that much stronger, so you don't have to feel obliged at running for the yellow guns.

here's the scar-l
http://i.imgur.com/f1QERxq.png

Carthalion
02-19-2016, 08:55 PM
I enjoyed the DZ in closed Beta as something to do when there was nothing left to do in the PVE part of the beta, in the full release of the game I don't think I'll have any motivation to go to the DZ specifically other than curiosity of what the DZ vendors might have and based on what rewards there is to be gotten via the quick route, I might run around for a bit but...but considering the large amount of PVE content that will be open to us on release, that interests me more right now than trying to engage in some spontaneous pvp. (I held the spring button for that whole sentence)

The DZ is on the list, it's just not at the top of mine right now.

kingofjamaica
02-19-2016, 09:30 PM
If it plays anything like the way it did in the closed beta(haven't gotten there yet in the open beta, as I'm technically at work right now), then as little time as possible, if any. If the rogue system gets properly fixed and they add a ton more content to the DZ, then I'll spend a lot more time in there.

BlacKxMasS
02-19-2016, 09:37 PM
What i am affraid of is that the game will resolve to much arround the darkzone,in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.


If it plays anything like the way it did in the closed beta(haven't gotten there yet in the open beta, as I'm technically at work right now), then as little time as possible, if any. If the rogue system gets properly fixed and they add a ton more content to the DZ, then I'll spend a lot more time in there.

Both of these comments is exactly how I feel.

SteampunkJester
02-19-2016, 09:54 PM
0%

Maybe jump into it a few times if I honestly don't have anything better to do but from my experience in the closed beta and my experience so far in the open beta I doubt my opinion is going to change once the game is released.

Axis Ltlforest
02-19-2016, 10:06 PM
As a primarily PVE player, I will spend little to no time in the DZ. If I put in the time to kill a named npc, make it to extraction, and then lose loot, rank, and currency because I am forced into the DZ against unscrupulous players for high end loot, I can't justify the waste of time. I don't need to take part in a gaming social experiment, especially not one that I have to pay to be a part of.

Give me an extraction horde mode against desperate infected or cleaners preventing further spread. If the DZ is the only place for high end gear, count me out.

RVSage
02-19-2016, 10:15 PM
Being a lone wolf, I would visit the dark zone occasionally for some loot. I am taking division as a single player experience

CaptCohl
02-19-2016, 10:49 PM
I wanted to re-post this here because I feel like it has a greater chance of being seen by someone who can record the feedback.


First off I love the idea of the dark zone. Yes, it can be incredibly frustrating getting killed by rogue agents(especially squads of 4 or two squads working together) but the idea of having a free for all zone is awesome. High risk = High reward.

Some game play features that I noticed while playing both the closed beta and again last night on the open beta I feel could be tweaked for a more balanced and enjoyable experience.

As Rogue Agents

1) Money collected from killing other players(body drop) is split among the squad. This will ensure the entire squad is rewarded instead of the one member that runs up and punches a downed agent taking all the 'loot'.

2) Limit the amount of money you can lose from your "pre-rogue" savings account. High risk is going rogue and especially getting rank 5 (Man Hunt). Currently, you only receive cash by being the one player that collects it from a downed Agent(high reward), however, dying in Man Hunt can net you a huge lose in your bank account without having even collected cash from dead agents. The 5 minute timer for 400-700 cash reward isn't incentive enough when facing a 1500-3000 loss in to your wallet.

As a Non-Hostile Agent

1) Money collected from killing Rogue Agents (body drop) should be split among the squad.

2) Increase the bounty for killing a Rogue Agent (based on the level of the Rogue Agent). Basically, make it worth my time to kill them because as of right now it's not unless they are in Man Hunt.

In General

1) Increase the cash (slightly) for killing the NPC's around the map. Scale per difficulty.

2) Health Bars - I know the patch note mentions you shouldn't be able to see a players health bar unless engaged with them. Health is still visible at all times.

3) Inspect Player - I have mixed feeling on this one... it would be nice to "checkout" the opposition to see how good their gear/stats/abilities are but at the same time in the DZ you never know what you're going to face and I like that as well. Maybe have a scan provide some of the basic info such as total dps, health, and tech power?

4) Auto Aim should only pull towards NPC's and Rogue Agents. It currently pulls towards anyone not in your squad. Helps avoid friendly fire when teaming up with other Non-Hostile agents.

Salvo1
02-19-2016, 11:11 PM
Very little, maybe as little as none. It's this weird mix of PVP and PVE that does neither well. If I want to PVP, I can't do it without going rogue and pissing people off and getting a bounty. If I want to PVE and group with people and use the Dark Zone as a dungeon, I don't want to have to worry about players ganking me and losing all my progress.

Plus, losing currency and rank whenever you die sucks, and makes me less interested in doing stuff in there. I want my PVE group content to be PVE, and my PVP stuff to be pure PVP. The Dark Zone just seems like a place to get ganked by griefers sitting at high levels with maxxed out gear. Which is ironic, because you're supposed to go in there to get better gear. Mark my words though, once the first few organized groups in there cap out on levels and gear, if they decide to sit around ganking everyone trying to extract gear in there, it'll be practically impossible to get anything done.

Plus, like others have said, why in God's name would you put valuable gear in a bright yellow satchel that says "rob me" and then take it out on a large, noisy helicopter you can see AND hear coming for miles? Wouldn't you sneak it out in a nondescript bag through a secret exit that no one knows about that's easy to reach and go through? I swear, the Dark Zone is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever seen.

MuramasaEdge
02-20-2016, 06:33 AM
I don't enjoy it and I would prefer not to, but to be honest, I expect that the game balance is going to be skewed horribly towards the Dark Zone gear and with that being the case, I'm sure that we'll be forced to and that'll probably not be OK.

Hidio
02-20-2016, 08:54 AM
I will dabble in tge DZ as I playthrough the campaign, but will focus on it absolutely at end game

kertikorte
02-20-2016, 10:20 AM
Exactly the time I have spent in PVP zones of other MMOs: zero.

FILO Death Lord
02-20-2016, 10:27 AM
how else do you expect me and my friends to get that good gear all them other players like to collect for us ?

i have already got both High End guns in both the open and closed beta and spend all my time in DZ trying to get some good loot but its slow to bad we dont get a reward for surviving manhunts and the DZ cash for it also is small

Kleavage
02-20-2016, 10:29 AM
It really depends on how the gear will be distributed between the PvE and Dark Zone content. If the best gear is only available in the Dark Zone, I would probably spend most of my time there. However, if they put gear into PvE content like raids that can rival the high end Dark Zone gear, I'll probably split my time between the two.

Sintinall
02-20-2016, 10:57 AM
Hopefully I wasn't just lucky with the players I ran into in the DZ. Most understood when I shot them and put my hands up since I'm a silent solo player and the rogue system needs tweaking. Can't play too much if I get PKed too often because I tend to rage when unfavorable things happen too often and I like the place where I'm currently living.

OzE_BeeJay
02-20-2016, 11:20 AM
Since there is only a couple of hours of non-DZ content, then of course the MAJORITY of time will be spend in DZ. Really looking forward to sinking my teeth into the story when it releases.

Bondse
02-20-2016, 01:10 PM
Hey

I was going to buy the game but after i read the best gear in the game was only to be found in DZ i decided not to.

Im a PVE player and i love to grind hours after hours to get the best gear in the game. But if that is not possible and i have to do pvp to get it this game is not for me.

My opinion is when you have to do pvp to get the best stuff the games turn more towards a pvp game than a pve game.

Good luck with the game.

Bondse

DieHarder55
02-20-2016, 02:15 PM
Right now, no more than 25% for me based on everything I have read about it. Doesn't seem to have any purpose like the PvE side. PvE has a story to go with the RPG. Might be fun to cross to get to another area of the PvE locations. But it seems no more than a different version of PvP to me. Why do I care to get better and better gear except to kill other players. If I could use the gear in the PvE side, then I would think about spending more time in the Dark Zone. But from what I read, anything from the Dark Zone is useless right now for PvE.

pride1982
02-20-2016, 02:19 PM
During The closed beta about the first half of the first day the dark zone was full of entrance campers going rogue for no reason other than to just kill people entering.

Then it seemed to balance out and people figured out what the dark zone was about and helping each other extract good items and baring the odd rogue agent the dark zone was a tense and rewarding experience.

But..... This time, there's groups hiding up on the ledge to the right as you enter just spawn killing, u cross paths with almost anyone and it's a grenade blast to the face and steal everything you've dropped, there needs to be some sort of bigger penalty to go rogue as its ruining the game experience to some degree, a squad of 5 rogues can pretty much run amok!!

The dark zone should be a mmo co op area with banks of enemies roaming around but no team killing, similar to the public missions in Destiny where multiple teams and squads join up to take on areas etc.

And have a seperate area for dedicated pvp, or failing that a "forgotten zone" which is basicly the Wild West and for people and enemies to just kill each other for control etc.

Otherwise I like the game it's almost everything I hoped it would be.

Ajax117
02-20-2016, 03:16 PM
Hi,

a few of us encountered this issue last night, a group of 4 rogue camping the entrance to the dark zone and killing us before we could mount a attack, how will you combat this issue? will you introduce npc "guards" to protect the initial area to stop camping?

Ajax117

TBB-Bara
02-20-2016, 04:22 PM
Ill do my best to stay out of it. The first chat line I read when in entered the game (as an african american character) was "black piece of ****" went on like this for a while so...ill steer clear of interacting with other people and just team up with my friends. No ´zone for me. Better for my bloodpressure.

Infidel5000
02-20-2016, 07:08 PM
I generally enjoy PVP modes in games, but not this one. I think it's an interesting idea that is poorly executed and I'm not sure how they can really fix it while keeping the same dynamic that they're looking for out of it. I think the entire rogue system is fatally flawed. The way it's currently designed makes it damn near impossible to successfully play rogue. The drawbacks to playing rogue are too great, and the benefits aren't great enough.

It's also damn near impossible for solo players to have much success in the dark zone in any way. I have a lot of friends who will be playing this game, but that doesn't mean I'll always have someone to play with. So I'll be playing solo on a somewhat regular basis, which really does not lead to an enjoyable experience in my opinion.

I also just don't like how the PVP feels in terms of TTK. It takes so long to kill a single player that it's rare you'll be able to take on more than 1 at a time and survive. It's also stupid that I can go rogue just for defending myself against someone who started shooting me first. Just because he didn't do "enough" damage I'm penalized for defending myself. Screw that!

I really hope that there is a deep PVE endgame with equally good gear as the DZ, because I can't see myself spending any time in the DZ in its current iteration. I applaud Ubi for trying something different, but IMO the DZ is garbage. I would honestly just prefer a traditional PVP mode at this point.

jeffman24
02-20-2016, 09:44 PM
I like the dark zone a lot, once I got a feel for it and how it works...it's intense and you really need to make sure you're careful in there - it's not a typical MP area (player vs player), but can be if you choose to, though there are risks.....and important not to have a trigger finger too when you see other players running by......yet to me I also want to see the PvE elements as well and focus on the campaign and explore that part of NYC as well. When I feel that I am at a good enough level with my character I'll definitely be open to exploring the area with friends, as I'd like to get my hands on the gear in there. Yet I also want to see the other single player stuff as well, because that's just as important as the DZ.

SONICLUKE88
02-21-2016, 12:25 AM
Always hunt in packs!!!

I'll be honest I didn't see the big deal about being in the DZ. And it really put me off going in there because someone would always go rouge, kill you and nick your contaminated stash, DZ money and experience which really frustrated me and almost made me not want to play the PvP... until today!

Today I spent well over 6+ hours in there and had fun. I teamed up and made friends with a random guy from the states and we were exploring the whole map, working together, getting great loot. We even hunted a few rouge agents and won. Today was my best day in the DZ... gained a lot of experience, extracted and purchased specialised and superior weapons and most of all had fun.

I think the key to the DZ is being in a group! Not really much fun on your own so I tried something new and teamed up with random person and it worked out really well. I think i'll spend 50% in the DZ just for collecting the best loot!!

FireNative
02-21-2016, 04:28 AM
I always do 90% of the side missions before I do ANY of the main story to level up, explore the map, and get good items before I tackle the story. I will spend about less than 10% in the DZ, to kill high level NPCs, get and buy high end loot.

durge67
02-21-2016, 06:43 AM
[QUOTE=in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.[/QUOTE]


This is one of my concerns as well. It plays to the advantage of the younger gamers who can go home and roam with Dark Zone with their buddies and go rogue on us guys trying to play in between work and other responsibilities. I would like a little more balance for players who are not hooked up with a group in the dark zone. It is too easy to for a gang of jerks to take out what could amount to a lot of hard work on your part if you are on your own.

durge67
02-21-2016, 06:48 AM
I enjoyed the DZ in closed Beta as something to do when there was nothing left to do in the PVE part of the beta, in the full release of the game I don't think I'll have any motivation to go to the DZ specifically other than curiosity of what the DZ vendors might have and based on what rewards there is to be gotten via the quick route, I might run around for a bit but...but considering the large amount of PVE content that will be open to us on release, that interests me more right now than trying to engage in some spontaneous pvp. (I held the spring button for that whole sentence)

The DZ is on the list, it's just not at the top of mine right now.

I just hope you have a chance and decent gear outside of DZ. Otherwise those of us that won't play it all the time will have no incentive the even try if there will just be gangs of high powered rogues whenever you go in there.

Daddy_Dry_Bone
02-21-2016, 07:45 AM
This is one of my concerns as well. It plays to the advantage of the younger gamers who can go home and roam with Dark Zone with their buddies and go rogue on us guys trying to play in between work and other responsibilities. I would like a little more balance for players who are not hooked up with a group in the dark zone. It is too easy to for a gang of jerks to take out what could amount to a lot of hard work on your part if you are on your own.

Yeah right now if your friends aren't online your basically tied to PvE because nobody can really be trusted unless you met that right kind of gamer who isn't a complete jerk which in the DZ is never.

DrExtrem
02-21-2016, 10:56 AM
In its current state 0-5%

In this game, I'll stick to pve. This might change in the future.

WhiskeyZulu60
02-21-2016, 11:02 AM
It will depend on the quality of the other content, would be a shame if there is not alternative rich content. DZ mandates a party or you will simply get used, no party no DZ. I'm not sure what if anything can be done but I've been experiencing rogue attackers who attempt to lag switch out of oncoming retaliation. Game is running fine up to the point that we attempt to swarm a group of rogues, then the lag begins in earnest. As soon as we kill them or they evade the lag stops.

DrExtrem
02-21-2016, 11:14 AM
It will depend on the quality of the other content, would be a shame if there is not alternative rich content. DZ mandates a party or you will simply get used, no party no DZ. I'm not sure what if anything can be done but I've been experiencing rogue attackers who attempt to lag switch out of oncoming retaliation. Game is running fine up to the point that we attempt to swarm a group of rogues, then the lag begins in earnest. As soon as we kill them or they evade the lag stops.

Ah. ... Crappy memories of warhammer online just came up. People used the "print screen button mash abuse", to bug away at close in to nail you in cc.

JuniorTheFreak
02-21-2016, 11:37 AM
0.00%, as in spending 0.00% in the game after trying out DZ.

As it says above, if all the good gear is in PvP forced areas, with chokepoints (entrances) held by a bunch of kids camping (as it was in both betas), then the point is moot.

After trying it out, getting killed instantly when entering and area, twice, from 2 different entrances, me and my mates just cancelled the preorders.

We were led to believe, it would be a fun coop experience, instead it is forced PvP, with little to no reward if you choose not to feed the camper trolls. Life´s to short to reward that kind of behaviour, so we did the adult thing, and chose not to pay entertaining a bunch of kids.

PandemicNitemre
02-21-2016, 12:44 PM
As little as possible really, I'm a PVE Lone Wolf. I really hope that some of the best gear will be available outside the DZ I don't like to be forced into PVP in order to get the good stuff, that's something that ruins a game for me and a single player. I may dip my toe in from time to time, but it is not going to be my main focus, I got lynched in there more than enough times (including literally as soon as I entered the DZ before i had any chance to find loot worth killing me for) during the closed and now open beta. Going it alone in there isn't really a viable option unless you want to get lynched and killed constantly.

Sparky862
02-21-2016, 01:26 PM
Fix or revamp the rogue system, and i will spend more time in there

kakarnage
02-21-2016, 02:20 PM
I spent some tine in the DZ and was kind of bored. I really don't care about loot, if I am doing ok in PVE with what I got then I am perfectly fine. So, without any miissions to do in the DZ I really don't see the appeal, unless you are a loot grinder which I am not. Or am I missing something in there?

the_don7684
02-21-2016, 04:14 PM
Probably as much as I can after completing all the storyline stuff.

Moravia01
02-21-2016, 04:19 PM
I intend to use the DZ to acquire good loot and occasionally take up the challenge to spend some time there with a team hunting rogues and training my survival capabilities, but I shouldn't spend the majority of time there.

Dat8bitFlow
02-21-2016, 04:30 PM
I'll be spending all of my time in the darkzone. I'm a PK, I don't enjoy killing AI much. But one problem I do have with the darkzone is that you have to play PvE to equip gear from the darkzone. I think their should be gear variants that only require darkzone level. That's a mistake bungie made with Destiny. PvP players don't get good rewards.

Kerjango
02-21-2016, 04:47 PM
It will be great to go in for a change to add another element to the game. However, for those of us that prefer the PVE elements of games like this though I hope that you do not make it so that the only way to get the 'best' gear is to be forced into the DZ. I understand that it is supposed to be a way to get the best gear, but forcing it is not something that should be done. As long as there is options for everyone to play how they want to play and not feel obligated to one thing or you get screwed over, it will keep the game feeling fair, and appeal to a wider variety of people.

devilmonkey77
02-21-2016, 05:21 PM
I'll be in it quite a lot. It would be great if some missions actually took you into the darkzone, or if there were more activities to pursue while in there.

Teufelhundin01
02-21-2016, 06:02 PM
Minimal at most. To easy to go rogue, penalty for going rogue is negligible at best, still way to easy to bait ppl into going rogue, and the work around to proximity chat gives an unfair advantage to ppl planning to ambush others.

Robot_Monkey
02-21-2016, 07:07 PM
Spending time in the DZ is also a question of the conveniences. I mean - only one bathroom in the saferoom for the whole DZ1&2?

DZ-PvP and PvE-requirements

... But one problem I do have with the darkzone is that you have to play PvE to equip gear from the darkzone. ...
It's not only the gear, you have to unlock and upgrade your pve-base to get your skills too.

I'm personally one of those who enjoy pve as well so it's not an issue for me, but having played Destiny I see your point. For those who haven't played it: Destiny's storyquests are quite bland, always following the same principle of fighting through a couple of rooms and facing a boss at the end. It's basically like a series of the more boring WoW-dungeons, only that often you had to go through the whole dungeon area several times. Example: You get Quest C in the base but to reach the beginning of the quest you have to run through the already played open area to the questzone (which you might have to do in Division as well and which isn't too much too ask for form a player I believe - fasttravel-points like camps might even be planned in the live game to reduce the distance travel to what we saw in the betas) . But in Destiny you also often had to go through the whole area of the earlier quests in that zone as well. To reach the area of the fifth mission in the enemy base you had to fight your way through the instanced areas of Missions 2-4 (without bosses). Might be fun the first time but if you have to run through there the third time and then afterwards get a daily quests that asks you to farm some items in that same base again... well it got boring after a while.
Unfortunately these missions only gave you enough xp to reach max xp-level, after that you had to level up your additional light-levels that were required for the better gear. And levelling those was basically a pure long pve-grind of repeatable daily quests, repeating storymissions and events.

While of course the main counterargument might be that this is not a pure pvp-game (never was intended to be) and therefore might simply not be what you are looking for, there might be a difference between Division and Destiny that might be important.

Destiny gives you only some small story-missions and the rest was a long pve-grind.

The Division might (I'm speculating of course) instead give you more xp for simply playing through the story once (with giving you at least some story). Even a hardcore-pvp-gamer might want to do that at least once (or be able to at least put himself through the trouble to endure it once ;) ). Of course that means the story has to be good and the missions have to be not just a repeatable grind. If a playthrough gives you enough xp and unlocks your skills fast enough it shouldn't be to much trouble for a pvp-player. Alternatively you could also add DZ gear without pve-requirements and base resources (to unlock the skills) in the DZ, so a pvp-player would only have to unlock the wings (which is basically done on the way the unlocking the DZ) and then he could go rogue in the DZ not caring about the fate of NY *cough*traitors*cough*).

So as long as it either doesn't take a huge grind like Destiny to reach the highest levelrequirement and unlock all skills (one simply playthrough) OR only require pvp-players to pve until the wings and the DZ are unlocked it shouldn't be a real problem for them pesky rogues. A little pve shouldn't be too much too ask for from a pvp-player. But a Destiny-grinder, that won't work well on PC I guess (didn't work well for some on PS4 either).

DZ-Poll and rogue
btw. one poll that is missing for the DZ would be:
The majority of times you went rogue in the DZ, was it because
A. ... I wanted their loot
B. ... I wanted to pvp not caring if they had loot
C. ... it was friendly fire, sorry my mistake.
D. ... wtf stop shooting my turret, run into my grenades on purpose and jump in front of my gunfire on purpose.

Because how much time people will spend there (and how) in the live game might be directly related to whether the situation with the rogue exploits can be mended.
The whole rogue-exploit-situation reminds me a bit of the very old shooter/mmorpg hybrid Neocron. If memory serves me right you could decide to permanently remove some sort of chip in your implants or gear that prohibited you from attacking other players (having the chip in also protected you from being attacked though, but removing it granted you a substantial XP-boost for taking that risk). A similar function might be welcome here.
Example (optional neocron chip in your equipment):
You can be attacked by other players in the DZ regardless if you have the chip in or out of your orange glowing Division-thingamajing (there should be NO immunity in the DZ).
However having the chip in basically turns "causing friendly-fire" off for you (like it does when playing pve in a group)*[/COLOR. Removing the chip on your equipment (free of charge, it's just ripped out) will allow you to turn rogue in the DZ at any time (including unintentional friendly fire). So rogues have to take the risk of having to watch more carefully where they shoot in exchange for the perk of being able to attack others. Putting the chip back in (at the vendor in the saferoom for example) could require a substantial DZ-credit payment and probably a long cooldown (maybe 24 hours, getting those high-tech-government-equipment replacement parts on the black market takes time and money after all), so people don't just turn it on and off all the time.
Of course you couldn't tell which agent has the chip in or out, or which grenade is friendly-fire safe, so you just have to watch your back as you already have to in the betas. It just means that non-rogues are safe from getting tricked into becoming rogue and enable player to easier stay in line with the games overall story and atmosphere. You are supposed to be one of the good guys after all and going back to your base after having just "accidently" killed some allied agents (having been tricked into rogue) does really feel disconnected from the rest of the story for the "nicer" players.

[COLOR="#FF0000"]* I know some rogues won't like that marked part (removing their ability to trick people into becoming rogue) but I don't think it was part of the developer's plans that people would exploit game mechanics to trick people into becoming rogue- Some longer lasting grenades, the sticky bomb and the turret would basically become unusable for non-rogues in the long run. And let's face it, forcing 1 player into becoming rogue just so your 2-4 man team can kill him without turning rogue yourself is hardly the challenge real pvp-players would look for. If you see yourself as tough pvp-players then at least have the guts that you have to live with the rogue status yourself for a while instead of childishly cheating the system and turning your pvp into nothing more than just cowardly griefing ;) .

DZ-Experience in the beta


As it says above, if all the good gear is in PvP forced areas, with chokepoints (entrances) held by a bunch of kids camping (as it was in both betas), then the point is moot. After trying it out, getting killed instantly when entering and area, twice, from 2 different entrances, me and my mates just cancelled the preorders.

Well, cancelling a preorder if you are unsure about the game is certainly a wise decision (one that doesn't apply to me as I liked it, but I never bothered with those spawncampers actually being happy to have them contained there instead of having them roaming the map).
But I wouldn't give up on the game just yet. You might want to keep an eye on the game to possibly order it again after the release. What we have seen in the beta was just a glimpse of the final game. And as it was a beta and not a demo (important and often misunderstood difference) the content we saw and it's extent are not necessarily representable for the finished game (which should be the case if it had been in a demo).
So there might be a lot of PvE-coop content in the final game.
I personally am hoping for some larger PvE zone that is filled with other players (without pvp) so you can take on harder bosses (like respawning, open andlarger bases of tougher enemies (Last man battalion for example) while working together with random players without having to form a party and being able to go your own way anytime you like. A bit similar to the open world of Destiny (tougher enemies though) or the experience of some mmorpg's where you can complete harder events (like in GuildWars 2) or encounters (like WoW worldbosses) with random players (without the need for grouping up or staying together after a fight).
As for the DZ. Once the DZ-level brackets are in place most trolls and rogue-squads might probably end up in higher tiers than regular players, so you won't see them as often anymore and meet more people on your personal level of experience.
And those chokepoints, there have been some mapchanges since the closed beta to remove some of those points. So it should be safe to assume that these points will get overhauled as well. Example: During closed beta there was a ledge on a high building opposite the northwestern extractingzone overlooking the higher parts of that Extr.Zone. You could get up there at 1 rope only, so it was perfect as trolling point. In the open beta this area is no longer accessible and the problem is fixed. Another example of what can be done is the Madison(?)-library's roof. While rogues can camp up there it is accessible from 3 sides making it a lot harder to defend. It also doesn't cover a choke point. Fighting rogues on that position is actually fair and fun (if the people fighting on your side are smart enough to use all three sides for their attack). Basically a camping position should have at least 3 possible attackpoints (like Extr.Zones) so even a 4-man team encamped there has to put up a serious and fair fight to stay alive.
That chokepoint at the beta's southern entrance is a good example of a point that needs to be fixed.
But hey, finding those spots, finding out how (roguesystem)and where (entrance camping) players would find ways to beat the system is exactly what the beta was supposed for. So your encounter of these things should not make you write off the game completely, because encountering and reporting it is exactly what this was for. See it as a glimpse of hope that the developers are actually trying (with this very beta for example) to identify those issues to fix them. Cause a small bunch of devs who should also be busy programming the game etc. can't beat a bunch of gamers let loose on a betaversion when it comes to finding bugs and exploits to fix.
So, if the betas caused you to have doubts cancelling the preorders is probably a wise choice for your group. But giving up on a game completely because of bugs and issues in a beta might defeat the purpose of that beta. Just keep an eye on it, it might turn out to be just fine.

weebarry86
02-21-2016, 07:09 PM
I'm hoping it will be 50/50 for me. Obviously the main storyline will have more to offer but it will all depend on what that is. The difference in loot between the DZ and the main map will depend on where I'm likely to spend most of my time. I don't know if it's possible to have the option to change matchmaking settings so players have the option to join groups using mics or not using mics. Have found during the open beta that I'm being matched with people who don't use mics which I feel ruins the gameplay experience, lets communicate people!!! All the same, absolutely can't wait to play the full game in March (2 days booked off work to dedicate to The Division) See you all in the DZ!!!!

Me_Eat_You_Guts
02-21-2016, 07:20 PM
Sadly, not very much. Most of my time online is spent alone and the Dark Zone just doesn't work for solo players. I started my session with 5000 credits yesterday and finalised with 2000 and had ranked down. Never once did I go Rogue intentionally (once another player stepped into my fire while I was shooting NPC's, the other my turret opened up on other players for some reason). Otherwise I was constantly hunted, murdered and robbed by other groups of players.

Turns out that, when given the chance to act like *******s anonymously, human beings will always act like *******s. Shocker.

qhifed
02-21-2016, 07:52 PM
The Dark Zone would be a lot more compelling if there were quests to do (like the side stuff in the pve area). Right now you just run around looking for packs of npcs to kill which gets boring super fast.

If its just going to be packs of npcs then they need to be a lot tougher / more numerous so that it takes multiple groups of players to take them on. This would create an interesting dynamic where you have to team up with other groups but the possibility is always there that one or more might betray the others to claim more loot.

GameJunkys
02-21-2016, 08:15 PM
I personally will be avoiding the DZ. It's nothing but a rogue troll fest full of big groups picking on solo players like myself. I honestly got ZERO enjoyment from the DZ, and completely gave up on it. A solo player has zero chance of being successful in my opinion. But i loved the PvE so load that down with content and I'll play the crap out of your game. And please make sure that us PvE only players can have access to the best stuff without having to enter that troll infested place you call the Dark Zone.

Misterscruff63
02-21-2016, 08:21 PM
I will be visiting the DZ I pay solo and don't have a problem the way it is set up at the moment, gone in teamed up and played solo and enjoyed it. Killed and was killed extracted plenty of gear enjoyed it played six hours solid this afternoon and seen no cheaters, which I was very happy about. Just found it more challenging fighting the npcs on my own they have armour now and having to put clip after clip to down them.

Michealrankin
02-21-2016, 08:54 PM
Being able to go rogue, count down to no threat then start all over again is ruining the game play in DZ. I would like too see a stat over the head of agents showing rogue activities. Some sort of warning system.

Friendly fire forcing a rogue agent is really off putting to DZ. I have had multiple instances of defending against rogue agents then all of a sudden I'm a rogue. This needs fixed.

Having good to rank up two levels DZ level and a game level is off putting.

Not being able to crouch or lie down is horrible.

Imo this had great potential but feel let down with the rogue play. So I will spend very little time in DZ solo play. Doubt I will team up with random players either, Due to betrayals.

Oh and where are the rocket launchers?????? Maximum destruction very little effort. Cos it's too much effort required to kill in the game....too much effort. Soooooo I think u should copy a game called "the last of us"....please do this and your game will be great.

Smoke_On_Fire
02-21-2016, 09:09 PM
My time in the DZ depends:
How much PVE can I do there, especially without being PVP killed often?
How much good loot can I extract without being PVP killed too often?
Will it be possible to Solo Play the DZ well?
Is there enough interesting PVE content outside of the DZ?
Will there after a few weeks be some groups of "always Rogue" who run around killing everyone because this is their style to do the endgame, making the whole area unsurvivable or camping extraction points for people that just want to play PVE? Or maybe will enough other players team up to kill them? And wont they just be back 1-2 minutes later because they essentially have not much to loose?

Time will tell.

Robot_Monkey
02-21-2016, 09:28 PM
Oh and where are the rocket launchers?????? Maximum destruction very little effort. Cos it's too much effort required to kill in the game....too much effort. Soooooo I think u should copy a game called "the last of us"....please do this and your game will be great.
Only if they come with the ability to rocket jump.
What about adding the Mini-nuke launcher from Fallout? That seems like a legit weapon for an urban environment with civilians around, doesn't it?
On a different note, will we be able to join the cleaner fraction? They seem to be the only ones with a good plan. Fire - always a good option.

nzBlustone
02-21-2016, 09:36 PM
Love the dark zone, hate how idiot players run through or stand right in your line of fire to AI enemies, the guys it has happened to me with have done it accidentally, have not had it done on purpose but that would be annoying.

That, if nothing else, will make me go career rogue. A fella has to defend himself after all.

A compound suggestion for going rogue in the dark zone:
1) Non-rogue agents do 20% damage to other non-rogue agents but have to deal the same amount of damage as currently to go rogue, making it take longer to go rogue but without increasing the health cost to the victim (I think this will encourage players to stay rogue if they intend to be rogue instead of popping in and out of rogue as it gives players a little more warning about turn-coats)

Guess its just the one idea...

defydra
02-21-2016, 09:37 PM
I will be spending about 35-40% of my overal game time in the dark zone depends on how much groups are on the server and big the dark zone is. When there are more established groups you tend to be outnumbered.

The Remander
02-21-2016, 09:44 PM
I'm more a PvE guy, but I'll definitely spend time in the DZ to get that top gear. Interested to see how the levels are stratified in the full game. Seemed good in the betas. Not too great a difference in ranks between players, so no real ganking going on.

vbrodal
02-21-2016, 09:49 PM
As it sits right now, the rewards from drops in the DZ are not worth the effort. The DZ vendors are the only worthwhile places to obtain gear. The fact you cannot play/party with anymore than 3 of your friends makes it challenging to differentiate who is friend and foe in the DZ once you go rogue, or your friends not partied go rogue. Reaching rank 5 rogue is fun, but not rewarding enough compared to the amount of funds and XP you lose when you die compared to surviving the timer.

beanhd
02-21-2016, 09:56 PM
0%

Maybe jump into it a few times if I honestly don't have anything better to do but from my experience in the closed beta and my experience so far in the open beta I doubt my opinion is going to change once the game is released.

someone got rekkd

Szabtom
02-21-2016, 11:03 PM
PvP in the DZ is the sole reason (gameplay wise) for me to buy the game. This last weekend was a real blast, I spent 2 hours in the sleepy zone and 20 hours in the DZ.

SteampunkJester
02-21-2016, 11:45 PM
someone got rekkd

If stepping out of the checkpoints and getting gunned down as soon as I load in over multiple instances is "getting rekked" then yeah, I did. Wasn't fun, wasn't enjoyable, and fully soured my experience with the DZ and somewhat soured my experience with the game in general.

ekko8484
02-21-2016, 11:58 PM
What i am affraid of is that the game will resolve to much arround the darkzone,in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.

^^^ This.

I was so happy when I heard you guys say on FB that the game is 100% solo'able... Then I heard the best loot is only attainable by going into the DZ, so disappointing.

To answer the question, it'll depend on how much I get killed by Rogues, if it turns out I'm just getting killed and unable to extract frequently, I'll be spending next to no time in there.

iota-09
02-21-2016, 11:59 PM
first time since closed beta that i've been able to spend more than 10 minutes in the dark zone without freezing/stuttering, it was fun, even though it was with my weakest character(full firearms build)

Hakgova
02-22-2016, 12:28 AM
Not really a pvp sort of player. Pvping just to say I killed another player for no other reason then self satisfaction is not my thing. While I may go into the DZ from time to time, it won't be to PvP.

MikeyMike5967
02-22-2016, 12:44 AM
I spend 30% of the time in the dark zone.

BigfootTornado
02-22-2016, 12:44 AM
If I'm in a group that wants to go I'll give it a whirl. I rolled in the DZ solo this open beta and experienced what I mostly expected, get attacked as soon as people see that extra bag you're carrying. Solo player is an easy target so I'll only head in with a few other people together. I've enjoyed what I've played outside the DZ so far so I'll happily stick to that most of the time.

Diomed2020
02-22-2016, 12:59 AM
I don't enjoy it and I would prefer not to, but to be honest, I expect that the game balance is going to be skewed horribly towards the Dark Zone gear and with that being the case, I'm sure that we'll be forced to and that'll probably not be OK.


During The closed beta about the first half of the first day the dark zone was full of entrance campers going rogue for no reason other than to just kill people entering.

Then it seemed to balance out and people figured out what the dark zone was about and helping each other extract good items and baring the odd rogue agent the dark zone was a tense and rewarding experience.

But..... This time, there's groups hiding up on the ledge to the right as you enter just spawn killing, u cross paths with almost anyone and it's a grenade blast to the face and steal everything you've dropped, there needs to be some sort of bigger penalty to go rogue as its ruining the game experience to some degree, a squad of 5 rogues can pretty much run amok!!

The dark zone should be a mmo co op area with banks of enemies roaming around but no team killing, similar to the public missions in Destiny where multiple teams and squads join up to take on areas etc.

And have a seperate area for dedicated pvp, or failing that a "forgotten zone" which is basicly the Wild West and for people and enemies to just kill each other for control etc.

Otherwise I like the game it's almost everything I hoped it would be.


I generally enjoy PVP modes in games, but not this one. I think it's an interesting idea that is poorly executed and I'm not sure how they can really fix it while keeping the same dynamic that they're looking for out of it. I think the entire rogue system is fatally flawed. The way it's currently designed makes it damn near impossible to successfully play rogue. The drawbacks to playing rogue are too great, and the benefits aren't great enough.

It's also damn near impossible for solo players to have much success in the dark zone in any way. I have a lot of friends who will be playing this game, but that doesn't mean I'll always have someone to play with. So I'll be playing solo on a somewhat regular basis, which really does not lead to an enjoyable experience in my opinion.

I also just don't like how the PVP feels in terms of TTK. It takes so long to kill a single player that it's rare you'll be able to take on more than 1 at a time and survive. It's also stupid that I can go rogue just for defending myself against someone who started shooting me first. Just because he didn't do "enough" damage I'm penalized for defending myself. Screw that!

I really hope that there is a deep PVE endgame with equally good gear as the DZ, because I can't see myself spending any time in the DZ in its current iteration. I applaud Ubi for trying something different, but IMO the DZ is garbage. I would honestly just prefer a traditional PVP mode at this point.

+1 Really hope that the game is 90/10
PvE to PvP. The DZ is interesting in concept, but really won't work without a lot of changes and major ongoing changes to stop people from constantly breaking the mechanics into griefing.
I appreciate the preview, hopefully the game is not dependant on dz, or that a future version is majority PvE, because that's the version I'll be buying.

Kisj
02-22-2016, 01:33 AM
The Dark Zone is my home, i will never leave!

XI am VengenceX
02-22-2016, 02:05 AM
dz isnt going to be the only source for high end top tier gear? if so i may consider cancelling my preorder and bowing out.

breagon1985
02-22-2016, 02:51 AM
One thing that is making me go between DZ and PVE area is the fact i'm finding blues and other vendor items seem to have better stats then some of the purples you get from DZ. Personal experience and it being a beta, but if i'm not finding a solid reason to spend alot of time in DZ won't be there alot.

Imbolnuva
02-22-2016, 03:25 AM
After playing the open beta, I'd have to say hardly any of my time will be spent in the Dark Zone unless I have a full group of 4, and even then, probably not too often. I simply do not like the idea of spending a couple of hours farming some items and whatnot, then losing it all for no real reason. By the time I respawn and get back into the DZ, the rogue that killed me is long gone, with my items to boot.


The Dark Zone would be more manageable if you reduced the impact health has while in that zone. For the most part people just stack the crap out of stamina, which effectively makes the other two stats useless for the Dark Zone.

Metalton
02-22-2016, 03:40 AM
personally, i don't like PvP type games, because i know i suck at them. that said, i really enjoyed how the DZ was an organic extension of the main experience, and how even though i wasn't doing anything new (just doing a diablo-style grind to find loot in chests with no real objective), there was still a bit of tension and purpose that kept it fresh, since i never knew if/when i was going to get stabbed in the back.

here's what i absolutely hate about the DZ: it's way too easy to accidentally go rogue. a couple times i was waiting for an extraction along with a handful of strangers (no one was hostile, everyone just wanted to keep their stuff), and inevitably i would accidentally wing someone with a stray round as we got attached by AI. Some people understood that it was an accident, and that despite being labeled a rogue, i wasn't gunning for them. others not so much. point is, there's got to be a way to better define the criteria that makes a player rogue, to ensure that the rogues actually wanted to go rogue. make it along the lines of shooting a player X amount of times in X amount of seconds (for example, 3 hits in 2 seconds is no accident), something that shows that the player had clear hostile intent and that it wasn't unintentional.

Also, I'm all for penalizing the player for dying, it spices things up a bit, but the cash and XP penalties need to be eased up. if i get bushwhacked at the last minute by someone who decides to go off the cuff and murder everyone around them, why should i be penalized? there's no way to predict what would happen, i didn't die because of my lack of skill. ease up the penalties all around to keep it from getting so discouraging that there's no incentive to play.

Me_Eat_You_Guts
02-22-2016, 04:11 AM
After another afternoon playing your game I would like to amend my previous reply:

I will be spending ZERO time in your broken, despicable Dark Zone. You've created a PvP experience that panders to locker room bullies. You should be ****ing ashamed of yourselves.

Darthriordan
02-22-2016, 04:18 AM
I don't see myself going into the Dark Zone at all, there's no reason to go in. I don't care about loot, too many people camp the entrances or the extraction sites to make it worthwhile.
I hope that you don't make any of the pace tie into the pvp, if so I will cancel my pre-order & can guarantee 2 other cancellations as well.
The pve has been fun, I look forward to it. But I'm never going into the DZ, it is just a frustration filled trip that isn't worth it.
If you think keeping all the good loot in there will convince me or others to go in you are mistaken.
I was doing very well with my 2 "crappy" weapons in pve. I don't need fancy shiney new toys enough to put up with the people who occupy the DZ.

egyptian02
02-22-2016, 06:11 AM
Prior to the open beta, I was very excited for this game but hadn't preordered. I love the story, agent customization, weapon options, everything....except the thought of the dark zone. Like everyone else is saying, large group areas when everyone needs to team up for an objective is awesome, except for the part where you can lose everything you worked so hard to acquire.

I will also be very disappointed if the best weapons possible are dark zone only. This should be in the main part of the game as well. I will say that I preordered this game after playing the beta, but don't plan on spending very much time in the dark zone if at all.

LordOfPit
02-22-2016, 09:15 AM
OK Ubisoft... here's the good stuff. To be honest, it looks like you've got a great game in the making. The cover system works! Weapons feel different from one-another. The abilities matter and are fun to use. Customisation of your character's gameplay and appearance are easy to get into and probably addictive to master. Being able to respec while not in combat is an awesome idea!! Bravo!

Now, for the bad part. The Dark Zones.

I've participated in the XB1 Alpha, and Closed Beta as well as the PS4 Open Beta. It only dawned on me recently though that since games like these have a longevity problem and content production isn't cheap, developers may consider PvP a filler that holds people in the game until new content arrives. This of course presents another well-known PvP-centric issue, how to continuously pump new-blood into PvP Zones that would keep the PvP sharks interested without degrading the PvP experience into segregated fight-clubs.

These issues, coupled with how silent Ubisoft is, lead me to assume the worst and contemplate a scenario where New York is divided into PvE and PvP zones, but to cross from one PvE zone to the next you will have to run-through PvP zones.

If this is the case, I want nothing to do with the game because it is easy to predict a type of player whose sole enjoyment from the game is taking their high-level character and harassing lower-level players who are merely trying to cross a DZ that just happens to be a required bridging corridor.

Because of the high plausibility of this scenario, I am cancelling my pre-order and will follow the game post-launch to see if I should buy or pass it.

Redbear17
02-22-2016, 11:48 AM
Me and my friends went into the dark zone last night and found it very very boring. AI enemies are very hard to find and there is very little to do. We found ourselves running around an empty area for ages doing nothing. If you want people to venture into the dark zone you are guna have to give us stuff to do. Tasks, missions and AI enemies to shoot. Some sort of guidance would be nice instead of running around clueless. The loot crates require keys which you can't get cuz there is nothing going on. We played the 2 story missions and enjoyed them but the dark zone really put us off with its lack of content.

ReddSmokee
02-22-2016, 12:48 PM
Alot, my only thing is my friends won't be able to keep up with my level

DactylicRocket
02-22-2016, 12:59 PM
Hey guys! I love the game, its amazing! About the Dz question, I really love that area. Yea, there were a couple bugs and glitches, but nothing to major. I think I would spend most of my time in the Darkzone. It's a really great area. But I also think that the NPC should be a little harder. We all had problems with them, but they could be a little harder ��

You should also add extra npc and rewards for killing them.








Thanks for The game guys!

-Patrick aka Dactylic Rocket

mezzatron
02-22-2016, 01:21 PM
Once I complete the Story Missions, I will be in the Dark Zone 99% of the time. However I will always make sure to go in with a fireteam of 4.
Playing the Dark Zone alone is suicide.

shadowfacex
02-22-2016, 01:49 PM
Me and my friends went into the dark zone last night and found it very very boring. AI enemies are very hard to find and there is very little to do. We found ourselves running around an empty area for ages doing nothing. If you want people to venture into the dark zone you are guna have to give us stuff to do. Tasks, missions and AI enemies to shoot. Some sort of guidance would be nice instead of running around clueless. The loot crates require keys which you can't get cuz there is nothing going on. We played the 2 story missions and enjoyed them but the dark zone really put us off with its lack of content.

This one of the reasons Dark Zone feels unfinished. AI respawns are few and far between, all in predictable places (mostly around landmarks), so there's little to do. IMO, AI enemies should be scavenging the place, just like players do, be constantly on the move in packs, with random respawn points, and multitude of classes/weapons/gear.

Overall, my problems with DZ are as follows (in the context of this game being a MMO-RPG-TPS hybrid):


Rogue system design is flawed in execution: the rogue status should be progressive, depending on the deeds a given rogue agent has done (good or bad).
Accidental friendly-fire (even grazing) is currently punishable by death by bystanders when your character turns red, which is in no way indicative that you've gone to the dark side.
The risk/reward ratio for going rogue is totally unbalanced. High risk, and little reward for evading man hunt.
There are currently no long-term consequences for going rogue, consecutively killing other agents (remember, we're part of the same agency, so we should work together, not turn on each other).
There's little AI presence, it's all spawned infrequently, and in predictable places.
The exploration part of the DZ is non-existent, as most containers (which there's very little of) require keys, which in turn have to be obtained from somewhere.
There are no objectives/tasks for the DZ. It's just an everyone for themselves kind of place, where you get to shoot at stronger AI and sometimes other players.


A few ideas here:

Rogue activity should be punishable in some way, even if all it does is introduce a character notoriety/reputation/karma, which can warn people scanning areas with Pulse Beacon. This should stay with players at all times, like in all decent RPGs, but be revealed only upon using an upgraded Pulse Beacon, or in very close proximity (when you can hear them talk, etc).
Reputation/notoriety/karma (if introduced) should be redeemable with fulfilling good deeds, such as helping NPCs, completing missions, rebuilding bases, helping other players in some way, etc.
Reputation should affect NPCs attitude towards our character, especially in the FOB staff and with JTF, with vendors having possibly higher prices, or DZ safehouses staying closed temporarily to rogues of overall good/neutral nature (until their DZ rogue status is gone), and permanently to those with chaotic or straight-up evil nature.
Allow private blacklisting of players within the game. A lot of people already do this manually with a pen and paper, but it would be much more intuitive to have an on-screen indicator, telling us that we've blacklisted a given player character (since one player can create many characters), for example for killing us without a reason.


Keep in mind that this is (supposedly) an MMO RPG shooter, but so far RPG elements are very shallow (focused on gear/character), which makes this game have little replay value as an RPG. Give us some tough choices, more side missions, or a random mission generator at least, with some variety.

This may be a bit of a wishful thinking, but I hope Ubisoft Massive listens to players with constructive feedback/criticism, as there are already loads of fanboys/haters in the other forum threads, preventing each other from expressing their thoughts "because you're wrong and I'm right."

PS. Ubisoft, please use a dedicated feedback/bug tracking system next time for your own good, as sifting through forums to gather constructive feedback is a herculean task.

Dante-Yoda
02-22-2016, 02:01 PM
None Ganking PvP doesn't interest me, no matter what loot they give.

After Beta the PvP just added to my hate of PvP even more.

RavenDeath_
02-22-2016, 02:10 PM
0%

Maybe jump into it a few times if I honestly don't have anything better to do but from my experience in the closed beta and my experience so far in the open beta I doubt my opinion is going to change once the game is released.

I agree. I'm tired of getting griefed in games by people who are only interested in being as obnoxious and destructive as possible. I'm interested in a co-op with my friends and doing missions for rewards.

The DZ experience can be a bit frustrating especially if you're trying to increase your level by killing NPC's and grabbing loot only to have some higher level, more experienced Rogue running around killing everybody with one shot. I'm not sure how this guy was doing it but he was running around killing everybody with one shot, 2 shots max and from long distances with a M1A. Even more frustrating when your group is behind cover working a bunch of NPC's to only have others shoot you all in the back.

I mean, you're concentrating on cover and fire from NPC's. It takes some real skill [sic] for someone to come up behind you all and grenade you and shoot you in the back while you're doing that. There's no time to react. You're just dead. Also, the turret bug was a real problem. Made the turret unusable in the DZ. That needs to be fixed.

All in all, I imagine the little kiddies will get their jollies in the DZ while the adults will be more interested in co-op missions in the PVE. I only hope the PVE is extensive and that the DZ isn't the holy grail for the devs for this game.

O Ambulo O
02-22-2016, 03:28 PM
I love how the Dark Zone puts you in a constant state of "who is following me".

Little Fixes:
-There were times where I wish I could duck while running, or even duck while standing against cover.
-I wish there was a tiny indicator that let me know if my mic was working. I see the voice waves above other players names and it would be nice to have one for yourself.
-If you surrender, you should be able to become lootable, otherwise the surrender is pointless.

General Suggestions:
-Factions with specific custom emblems or a spray paint would be cool.
-Exicutions would be fun.
-I wish I could use my fists or a melee weapon to duel people.
-Taking hostages and putting handcuffs on people would be cool too. That could set off a rogue status and people could save the hostage agent.
-I love sniping but there aren't many sniper specific locations. I just wish there were a few buildings I could sit in across the street from an extraction zone to give support... Or take out my fellow agents.
-I really hope there are more missions in the DZ instead of shoot all the AI. It was fun for the beta but I could see that getting old.

Overall I enjoyed the Dark Zone. I spent most of my time there.

C J Breen
02-22-2016, 04:50 PM
I chose the 1 - 25% poll option but it's really 1-10% for me. PVP in most games is toxic unless if its a server with an actual human mod. I had some fun in the DZ during the closed beta, but for some reason the DZ during this open beta was horrible. Maybe I just live close to crappy people.
And don't get me wrong, if I'm carrying a yellow pack then I consider myself a target and, once I've cooled down after being killed, I understand why a group of guys killed me. But I was getting shot when I had nothing on me. And I saw spawn trappers, guys purposely taking pop-shots at me to try to make me go rogue, and way too many people running in front of my fire for it just to be an accident. I watched a streamer I normally respect running around with glee shooting at people's turrets to make them go rogue and running into their fire or grenades. If a normally good guy was doing that then I can't imagine how the people who are already horrible human beings will act.
I'll check out the DZ in the full game but if it's nothing but griefers and trolls then I'm out. If it's more like the people I met in the closed beta then I may spend 25% in there.
Also I'm old (over 30). None of my friends will play this game and I'm not interested in buddying up with strangers because then they start bugging me constantly and sending friends requests because they want me to play 8 hours a day like them.

Edit: And I forgot the hacking. I know that the PC was hacked and I thought I heard that the PS4 version also had hackers. If I start hearing about the Xbox version getting hacked and you are more interested in selling DLC instead of fixing exploits or hacks then I won't bother going into the DZ. I'm not going to put up with getting one-shotted from someone skipping around or an invisible, invincible agent.

xMarTiiniix
02-22-2016, 05:24 PM
DZ is amazing... Please don't change anything

Pinkerton985
02-22-2016, 06:38 PM
I will avoid the DZ like it's a real life quarantined zone. If the experience I had during the open beta will be anywhere near same when the game officially releases, then the high end loot can go to hell. I won't step foot in there.

fer_mendivil96
02-22-2016, 07:47 PM
there wasn´t many missions for teams, missions in general, so try to no get bored the people in the other zones around DZ, also bounty hunter missions are good idea for using echos in the game, because there was one similar only in the beta.

MuramasaEdge
02-22-2016, 08:28 PM
I agree. I'm tired of getting griefed in games by people who are only interested in being as obnoxious and destructive as possible. I'm interested in a co-op with my friends and doing missions for rewards.

The DZ experience can be a bit frustrating especially if you're trying to increase your level by killing NPC's and grabbing loot only to have some higher level, more experienced Rogue running around killing everybody with one shot. I'm not sure how this guy was doing it but he was running around killing everybody with one shot, 2 shots max and from long distances with a M1A. Even more frustrating when your group is behind cover working a bunch of NPC's to only have others shoot you all in the back.

I mean, you're concentrating on cover and fire from NPC's. It takes some real skill [sic] for someone to come up behind you all and grenade you and shoot you in the back while you're doing that. There's no time to react. You're just dead. Also, the turret bug was a real problem. Made the turret unusable in the DZ. That needs to be fixed.

All in all, I imagine the little kiddies will get their jollies in the DZ while the adults will be more interested in co-op missions in the PVE. I only hope the PVE is extensive and that the DZ isn't the holy grail for the devs for this game.

QFT

The 'Gank people for the lols' mentality is what has been slowly driving me away from multiplayer gaming and it's really funny to me that these same people preying on others and enjoying behaving like scumwits towards others don't understand or realise that they kill their own enjoyment over time, because they give the games they play a reputation for toxicity, be it League, RUST, DOTA, CS:GO, Halo or many more besides, and will potentially lead to many either not buying and not trying the game out of expectation of being screwed over in-game by this kind of scumwittery or picking up the game on an extreme discount and playing only the PVE...dwindling and diluting the playerbase almost from the get-go.

I have a hard time motivating myself to buy this day one because of what I and friends of mine have experienced of the DZ gameplay and I know that I'm not alone, especially if this forum is anything to go by. It's going to be very interesting to see the launch numbers for this one.

ViktorBjornlund
02-22-2016, 08:35 PM
This one of the reasons Dark Zone feels unfinished. AI respawns are few and far between, all in predictable places (mostly around landmarks), so there's little to do. IMO, AI enemies should be scavenging the place, just like players do, be constantly on the move in packs, with random respawn points, and multitude of classes/weapons/gear.

Overall, my problems with DZ are as follows (in the context of this game being a MMO-RPG-TPS hybrid):


Rogue system design is flawed in execution: the rogue status should be progressive, depending on the deeds a given rogue agent has done (good or bad).
Accidental friendly-fire (even grazing) is currently punishable by death by bystanders when your character turns red, which is in no way indicative that you've gone to the dark side.
The risk/reward ratio for going rogue is totally unbalanced. High risk, and little reward for evading man hunt.
There are currently no long-term consequences for going rogue, consecutively killing other agents (remember, we're part of the same agency, so we should work together, not turn on each other).
There's little AI presence, it's all spawned infrequently, and in predictable places.
The exploration part of the DZ is non-existent, as most containers (which there's very little of) require keys, which in turn have to be obtained from somewhere.
There are no objectives/tasks for the DZ. It's just an everyone for themselves kind of place, where you get to shoot at stronger AI and sometimes other players.


A few ideas here:

Rogue activity should be punishable in some way, even if all it does is introduce a character notoriety/reputation/karma, which can warn people scanning areas with Pulse Beacon. This should stay with players at all times, like in all decent RPGs, but be revealed only upon using an upgraded Pulse Beacon, or in very close proximity (when you can hear them talk, etc).
Reputation/notoriety/karma (if introduced) should be redeemable with fulfilling good deeds, such as helping NPCs, completing missions, rebuilding bases, helping other players in some way, etc.
Reputation should affect NPCs attitude towards our character, especially in the FOB staff and with JTF, with vendors having possibly higher prices, or DZ safehouses staying closed temporarily to rogues of overall good/neutral nature (until their DZ rogue status is gone), and permanently to those with chaotic or straight-up evil nature.
Allow private blacklisting of players within the game. A lot of people already do this manually with a pen and paper, but it would be much more intuitive to have an on-screen indicator, telling us that we've blacklisted a given player character (since one player can create many characters), for example for killing us without a reason.


Keep in mind that this is (supposedly) an MMO RPG shooter, but so far RPG elements are very shallow (focused on gear/character), which makes this game have little replay value as an RPG. Give us some tough choices, more side missions, or a random mission generator at least, with some variety.

This may be a bit of a wishful thinking, but I hope Ubisoft Massive listens to players with constructive feedback/criticism, as there are already loads of fanboys/haters in the other forum threads, preventing each other from expressing their thoughts "because you're wrong and I'm right."

PS. Ubisoft, please use a dedicated feedback/bug tracking system next time for your own good, as sifting through forums to gather constructive feedback is a herculean task.

Totally agree with this. The problem with accidental friendly-fire is horrible. And some people try to piss others off by firing one or two shots which doesn't make them go rogue, really annoying, this should have a negative effect on their REP or something...

You lose way to much DZ XP if you die when you're rogue stage 1. Unbalanced..

I also hope there will be more PVE-raids or dungeons (Possibly in the DZ, but entered through instances with a cooldown) with bosses that occasionally drop rare loot. Like in WoW.

There are many things to improve, but overall it's a really cool innovative game.

Tactica01
02-22-2016, 09:00 PM
As little as possible. None would be ideal! I hate pvp... this is an rpg mmo! Im here for fiction, immersion and contwnt either solo or coop... im not here to thumbstick challenge other players, get my crap stole, steal other players stuff, constantly here players going rogue... etc... if thats what your selling, then why make all the live action trailers about agents working together helping, cleaning up against the chaos, fighting togeter against threats and helpung the destitute and impoverished? Where was the trailer with agents trying to do good, but getting killed and their crap stolen... or agents holed up and wrecking all who came at them from a high vantage point... or a copter coming in and agents sending out supplies omly to get grenaded to death before they could succeed with the 13 yr old kid or high 20-something laughing at how he just ruined those agents day? I guess that would not have made the best commercial... it doesnt make a good game concept either!

Im not here for any of that... please do not make your end game or any part of our progression rely on it for the good loot or content... rpg payers are her for the RP in RPG... dont lose sight. Blending pve and pvp is a bad recipe.

I have no intentions of going into pvp unless forced for progression... and if i am forced, i hope to opt out by selection or flag to not partake in the headache that is pvp.... Its not why im here and not why i play any rpg... pve end game content and specialization or paragon level equivilents is the recipe im here for.

Halo / cod crowd has their franchises... nuff said.

Zakuaz
02-22-2016, 09:49 PM
I voted 50-75.

Really though it depends on how much content resides in the areas outside of the DZ. How much -if any- type of dynamic or evolving gameplay takes place in the PVE section after you have completed the main story.

I know I'll be in the PVE area a lot the first couple of weeks after launch then as content there dries up ( if it does...who knows) I will migrate to the DZ.

If there are roving gangs that randomly spawn in the PVE area and other random ecounters; I'd have no problem continuing from time to time to run around outside the DZ to shoot at stuff.

Jacobyte-2014
02-22-2016, 10:15 PM
I doubt I'll spend much time at all in the DZ. I certainly did not enjoy the gangs of Rogues camping around extraction areas and *** raping everyone with total impunity even less the utter humiliation of knowing they got all my good gear I'd worked hard to get. I even lost the DZ keys the Devs had kindly gifted me.

Xion_Stellar
02-22-2016, 10:22 PM
I will be spending a great deal of time in the Dark Zone once I'm finished with the core content of the base game.

Saikyohero
02-22-2016, 10:38 PM
What i am affraid of is that the game will resolve to much arround the darkzone,in the closed beta only thing players were doing was playing darkzone to rush to the best waepons available in the game.
I for one,and i think a lot of other players don't like to be forced into pvp to get the best stuff,therefore i hope that i can get good items through pve content as well.
I am not saying i wont play darkzone at all,but for me personaly gonna play the game for the story/pve content mostly so i hope Ubisoft didnt put main focus on darkzone content.

There's a reason why it's a standalone poll asking about the dark zone. Speaks volumes.

Grumpybum
02-23-2016, 01:44 AM
This one of the reasons Dark Zone feels unfinished. AI respawns are few and far between, all in predictable places (mostly around landmarks), so there's little to do. IMO, AI enemies should be scavenging the place, just like players do, be constantly on the move in packs, with random respawn points, and multitude of classes/weapons/gear..............

I agree with everything in this guys post.

Kurohyou
02-23-2016, 02:18 AM
If the DZ is nothing more than what we saw in the Beta (I know it's bigger from the map). Then I plan on spending very little time in it, or probably in the game in general after I finish the campaign. I was expecting there to be actual content in the DZ, objectives to complete, encounters that would pop up, civilians to rescue. That was pretty much the promise of this game. What we've got is just one giant MP slug fest with backstabbing and NPCs added in. If that's all the DZ has to offer, the promise of better loot won't be enough to get me to waste more than a few hours in total there, probably right before deleting the game from my hard drive. I've really got to stop buying into the hype machines and pre-ordering.

TurbanSoviet
02-23-2016, 03:03 AM
I spent 60% of my 48 hrs in the closed and open beta in the DZ. But I spent 25% of my time in the alpha in DZ which was 45 hrs so me and the 15 people I know will be in the DZ after and during the game

cheradenineZ
02-23-2016, 03:46 AM
A number of variables will determine this:
How big is the area?
DZ missions?
How many of my friends are online?
Will there be issues or exploits with the rogue system that make the DZ less enjoyable?

I've loved my time in the DZ for both betas, but eventually you just run out of things to do and reason for being there.

ddomero
02-23-2016, 05:19 AM
I'd play as much as I possibly can juggling real life duties and the game. Thing is what i'm concerned about is the content after full release and if it'll be a crazy grindfest. I do not want to spend 5 hours each day for 10 days just to get something i want.. that is ridiculous.. So far I'm liking the game.. I'm just wondering will it be worth my money for full release

Kalamath23
02-23-2016, 05:27 AM
I'm already seeing a bunch of "We don't liked to be forced to PvP" posts. I'd be fine if the whole map was open world PvP to be completely honest. It will inevitably happen where casual players will PvP once a week and whine about weapon "X" or ability "Y" on social media and the forums to the point where it either gets nerfed into the dirt or removed. Ubi, please don't fall into this trap. Please don't go all crazy trying to "balance" an RPG. The committed players who play "the game" as it was intended, by playing the full game, including PvP should be able to get better gear and have an advantage because of the their commitment. That is how RPG's work. You don't get to go hang out in lowbie encounter areas and get gear on par with high level play by running the same EZ mode instances over and over. As a person who has played RPGs on both pen and paper and digitally for over 30 years, I can safely say you never got the epic flaming sword of +10 attack by never leaving the village and avoiding the dragon.

If you don't like PvP fine. Don't cry that the best drops are in the DZ. With greater risk comes greater reward. That's the game. If you don't like it go play Angry Birds.

Madcap Luck
02-23-2016, 07:06 AM
I redid all of the side missions and story missions, the second I hit 8 I went into the DZ.. Only coming out to clear my stash, or to run a mission or two with mates, AND to help civilians in need of course :)

Johnspartanxxxx
02-23-2016, 09:41 AM
Greetings agents,

While we’re thankful for all the effort you put into taking back the more secure parts of New York, we’d like to ask you to make a difference in the Dark Zone.

We’re aware that it’s a scary place to find yourself, but maybe, the longer you spend there the more comfortable you’ll feel constantly living in the face of danger?

Anyway, we’re looking to find out just how long you’re willing to spend in the Dark Zone this time around.

//- End Transmission_

i enjoy the dark zone but here are the main issues i have with it.

the first and most annoying is the fact that there are so many CQB fights and if a friendly so much as steps in front of you then you turn rogue and everyone kills you. it should be that you MUST kill an agent to turn rogue not simply graze them.

also WHY when i die by a random rouge am i punished for it? i lose large amounts of DZ xp and cash because i get shot in the back waiting for exfil by a "teammate" please fix this.

also WHY can i not fast travel in the DZ???? you cant possibly expect me to constantly run all over the place. its fun for the first week but then it will get annoying.

the weapons need to be stronger as the player ranks up. how many times i saw an enemy with a baseball bat charging me and i dump an entire mag into him at point blank range and still need to pull my magnum out to finish him off. its crazy. also the ai is super smart and adaptive which is great because they flank and attack smart making for a challenge. but you gotta make it easier for a solo player to attack groups alone. we dont all always play with other people and shoudl not be forced to. make my deployable sentry gun last 90 seconds and that problem is solved.

in my opinion all the guns need to be buffed against AI.

there is no need for a rogue. it should be removed from the game altogether. we are all supposed to be a team. why would be kill each other? makes zero sense. the game is SO much better team played. all objectives are easier to tackle as a team. why should a few random team killing asholes be allowed to ruin it?

add an rpg and minigun. more destructibles. .

ChequeSix
02-23-2016, 02:20 PM
My answer was over 50%, but a lot depends on the challenges and adventure available outside. The non-DZ content beta content through pretty quickly.

TheBadMan_
02-23-2016, 02:29 PM
Have to say that taging enemy should only make you YOU yellow and let only victim's team decide to kill you or not and becoming full rogue after you END your victim. That would decrease the ROGUE EXPLOIT A LOT, and at least give accidental shooters a higher chance to run away alive ( they usualy have to run ;D)

lappis82
02-23-2016, 04:31 PM
All depends on how effective the anti cheat are. i like the exitement and its fun to hunt rogues or camp out rogues to be at EZ

BrockLanders_OG
02-23-2016, 06:08 PM
50%

ZephyrN
02-24-2016, 04:35 PM
The answer to this question depends solely on how much other content is present. The DZ is great. My friends and I certainly had a great time there. If there is plenty of other content, maybe 50/50, but if there is a shallow pool of content beyond story mode and DZ, then we'll probably spend too much time in the DZ, and burn out quick.

GameJunkys
02-25-2016, 04:31 AM
Let me start by saying i had a great time playing the Beta and will defiantly being buying your game.

Heres my hope for the Division and will also decide whether or not i purchase additional content later on. My enjoyment comes from the PvE side of the game. I can't begin to tell you how much fun my brother and I had playing the missions, and looking for groups of thugs to eradicate, just an absolute blast! So of course i wanna see a fair focus on that in future DLC. Id also like to see a complete seperation between PvE and PvP.. Why you may ask?? Well the answer is quite simple.. Im not a PvP player. And i don't like being forced to take part in that element of a game. So with that in mind please don't shaft the PvE players with garbage drops which would force us to take part in a section of a game that we don't like just to get decent gear, cause ultimately I would just end up pissed off and drop the game. A seperation is needed between the two modes, and i personally think PvP should always be optional.

So on to the DZ. I personally only spent a few hours in the DZ, and really just didn't care for it. I was admittedly curious at first, but that curiosity soon turned to disappointment, and I eventually just gave up entirely on it, and just went back and played the story missions over. So in closing on the DZ. Not for me, not interested, please dont force me to play there.

In closing great work so far Ubisoft, the game looks great, and the PvE is just too much fun! Keep that PvE content pumping, and I'll buy every pieace of DLC you release.

Infantry4life81
02-25-2016, 06:51 AM
I loved the Beta and was thankful for the opportunity and experience.

My Dark Zone experience was not the greatest for 2 distinct reasons. One was some of the people I play with like to go Rogue and had top level gear where I on the other hand, had maybe a Blue item, was levels below and but the end of the weekend I had lost all my DZ money, 4 DZ levels, and some decent items. That put a bad taste in my mouth a bit. I would go off and look for items and I understand the rarity levels as RPG games are not new to me, but the lack of anything above blue weapons kinda was disappointing as I was seeing other colored weapons being used.

So some bad players and bad luck left a less than desirable experience in the Dark Zone. It however will not stop me from playing the game as the rest of the game was awesome.

Anubis____
02-25-2016, 07:55 AM
Dark zone should have quick spawning overwealming AI enemy's on every street

ELITEHATE
02-26-2016, 07:35 AM
I'm sure I will be spending most of my time in DZ. I had fun killing everyone I seen trying to lone wolf it sticking to the shadows. I would either lone wolf it or run a 4 man wrecking crew. The beta was amazing can't wait for the full content.

stylez-one
02-28-2016, 05:38 PM
it depends on how the full game turns out..but i'd say at least 50/50 or 60/40 in fav for dz.